When the bombs fell...

Postby haloguy » Tue Nov 23, 2010 2:13 pm

Today, North Korea unleashed an attack upon a small fishing village on an island very close to the DMZ. The fighting was prompted when the south koreans were conducting military exercises, and they were firing shots away from the North, but the north took it as a threat.

They unleashed over 100 shells towards the village in the course of 2 hours, killing 2, and injuring at least 18, causing unstoppable fire and damage. The south responded by bombarding them back and scrambling f-16s.

The north causalities from the return is expected to be high, and they may respond with more force. Tensions have been mounting since their tests of rockets in early '09.

What does this mean, the beginning of Korean War 2.0?
what side will china take?
what stance will the US take, will we get involved?

and most importantly, what will be the outcome of the ending of this matter

Re: When the bombs fell...

Postby Chris12 » Tue Nov 23, 2010 2:32 pm

North Korea should stop its war mongring attitude.

I think the USA will probably help the south if they went to war and China would probably stay officially neatral but still help north Korea a bit

Re: When the bombs fell...

Postby Scottstud94 » Tue Nov 23, 2010 2:46 pm

Interesting what would happen. Most countries would side with the south

Re: When the bombs fell...

Postby Wedgieboy14 » Tue Nov 23, 2010 2:49 pm

According to North-Korea, the south attacked first, but I have my doubts about those claims.

North-Korea would surely lose if it came to war. They don't have the recources to fight with South Korea, because other nations will surely ally with the south. It makes me wonder why they did it with that in mind.

Re: When the bombs fell...

Postby haloguy » Tue Nov 23, 2010 2:57 pm

Wedgieboy14 wrote:According to North-Korea, the south attacked first, but I have my doubts about those claims.

North-Korea would surely lose if it came to war. They don't have the recources to fight with South Korea, because other nations will surely ally with the south. It makes me wonder why they did it with that in mind.


the south koreans were conducting military drills near the DMZ using only blanks pointed away from the north, the north thought that the south was threatening them, they opened fire

also, remember, north korea has one of the largest armies in the world, over 2,000,000 enlisted, with pretty advanced stuff, they could put up one helluva fight, at least in their own borders if it came to that

Re: When the bombs fell...

Postby haloguy » Wed Nov 24, 2010 1:25 pm

yes, but if they think that we will go broke over this, we wont, If they do this one more time, we fight, and make them pay for it in the end.

today, the President dispatched the aircraft carrier U.S.S. George Washington to the Yellow Sea along with a smaller fleet with it. They will be conducting military drills to act as a deterrant to the North Koreans and to act as something to make china to tighten the korean's leash.

I really think that this fleet was moved into position just in case. With a fleet of about a dozen ships in the area, the George Washington leading them, and the South Korean armada within a couple of hours, we can easily strike at north korea if the need arises. Almost as if we are taking out the gun and cocking the trigger

Re: When the bombs fell...

Postby Chris12 » Thu Nov 25, 2010 4:05 am

North Korea has anounced a second and third ''retalliation'' if the south and America won't stop ''provoking'' them

Re: When the bombs fell...

Postby BandanaGags » Fri Nov 26, 2010 10:49 pm

We'll have to wait till Sunday to see what happens. That's when S. Korea and the U.S. are planning on conducting their military drills. Hopefully N. Korea won't react as harshly as they say they will. I also hope that China will remain somewhat neutral and try to convince N. Korea to calm down.

Re: When the bombs fell...

Postby Jason Toddman » Sat Nov 27, 2010 12:49 pm

H.G.Wells pointed out almost a century ago that nations with active foreign policies always bankrupt themseves and become second-rate powers. It happened to Spain, France, England, Germany, and now it's going to happen to us as well. It was nice while it lasted.
Anyone fancy having China be the next world power calling the shots?
It's going happen the way things are going now; probably within the lifetimes of at least the younger members here.
Maybe even mine, and if you know how old *I* am that should scare the bejesus out of you all!
Last edited by Jason Toddman on Sat Nov 27, 2010 10:26 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: When the bombs fell...

Postby anjell » Sat Nov 27, 2010 1:02 pm

I don't live in the states and that could scare the bejesus out of me. but China is not as bad as alot of people think.
Let's use all the colors.
Dust 'em, Pix!
Yup! That tasted purple!

Re: When the bombs fell...

Postby Kyle » Sat Nov 27, 2010 10:47 pm

China's worse to their own people than they are anyone else.

Re: When the bombs fell...

Postby Jason Toddman » Sat Nov 27, 2010 11:28 pm

Kyle wrote:China's worse to their own people than they are anyone else.

Tel that to the Dalai Lama and the people of Tibet.
Dare to be different... and make a difference.
To boldly go where no one in their right mind has gone before...

Re: When the bombs fell...

Postby haloguy » Sun Nov 28, 2010 6:59 am

Please, everyone, stay on topic and take this argument to the pms or else this topic will be locked

Re: When the bombs fell...

Postby xtc » Sun Nov 28, 2010 7:30 am

I would have thought that these arguments WERE on topic.
As ever, in the event of a war, the "superpowers" will always fight it on someone else's land wherever possible.
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but little speedos rule!

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Re: When the bombs fell...

Postby haloguy » Sun Nov 28, 2010 7:46 am

these arguments are not on topic here. I was talking of north and south korea, and then people started talking about how china treats their people

so please people, take it outside or I will ask for this topic to be locked

Re: When the bombs fell...

Postby Jason Toddman » Sun Nov 28, 2010 8:48 am

Why are people becoming such sticklers for 'off-topic' mentions here? China has everything to do with this; it's North Korea's biggest supporter.
Anyway, If you think China won't get involved in this situation if it comes to violence, you are far more naive than I thought.
Dare to be different... and make a difference.
To boldly go where no one in their right mind has gone before...

Re: When the bombs fell...

Postby Wedgieboy14 » Sun Nov 28, 2010 9:42 am

China is in a difficult situation, although they are north Korea's biggest supporter, they still want to keep positive relationships with the rest of the world.

Re: When the bombs fell...

Postby Kyle » Sun Nov 28, 2010 12:10 pm

Jason Toddman wrote:
Kyle wrote:China's worse to their own people than they are anyone else.

Tel that to the Dalai Lama and the people of Tibet.


Thanks for proving my point. Tibet is part of China.

Re: When the bombs fell...

Postby Kyle » Sun Nov 28, 2010 12:13 pm

haloguy wrote:Please, everyone, stay on topic and take this argument to the pms or else this topic will be locked


You mentioned China yourself, and I wasn't aware you had administrator privileges anyway.

Re: When the bombs fell...

Postby Chris12 » Mon Nov 29, 2010 2:45 am

I doubt it will actually come to war. North Korea isn't stupid they know they can't take on the whole western world

Re: When the bombs fell...

Postby Jason Toddman » Mon Nov 29, 2010 8:08 am

Chris12 wrote:I doubt it will actually come to war. North Korea isn't stupid they know they can't take on the whole western world


I hope you're right about that Chris. Personally I am not as assured of North Korea's sagacity as you seem to be. But incidents involving North Korea wouldn't be anything new. There were incidents involving them even when I was your age or even younger. One involving the detention of a US warship called the Peublo comes to mind.
Dare to be different... and make a difference.
To boldly go where no one in their right mind has gone before...

Re: When the bombs fell...

Postby haloguy » Mon Nov 29, 2010 2:28 pm

It is obvious that if they went to war, they would lose. The only things that I am worried about if that happens are such

1: the deficit increases
2: all of our troops so near china may increase tension
3: north korea nuclear mining the road to pyongyang (imagine how terrible that would be, thousands upon thousands killed by a nuke hidden beneath the ground)
4:the loss of thousands if not millions of civilians

north korea knows it is fading, they may just want to be going out "with a bang"

Re: When the bombs fell...

Postby zanev » Mon Nov 29, 2010 4:14 pm

Try to stay on topic please.
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And reminisce of those palmy days
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As long as I breathe
I'll call you my home

Re: When the bombs fell...

Postby Chase Ricks » Mon Nov 29, 2010 4:43 pm

If there is a war, I will be praying for the safety of an aunt and uncle currently residing in Seoul, South Korea. To keep this on topic still, I advise all to create an online boycott of the products North Korea exports. Perhaps if enough join, their economy will suffer and they will run out of money to finance their military.
From whence I came and whence I went heaven said I was too evil and sent me to hell. Demons and devils succeeded in breaking my soul.

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Re: When the bombs fell...

Postby haloguy » Mon Nov 29, 2010 5:49 pm

Shane Bikman wrote:If there is a war, I will be praying for the safety of an aunt and uncle currently residing in Seoul, South Korea. To keep this on topic still, I advise all to create an online boycott of the products North Korea exports. Perhaps if enough join, their economy will suffer and they will run out of money to finance their military.


ehh, north korea doesn't really export much to the USA, and thanks z!

Re: When the bombs fell...

Postby Chris12 » Tue Nov 30, 2010 6:41 am

North Korea probably doesn't export much to any nation except China

Re: When the bombs fell...

Postby snobound » Tue Nov 30, 2010 6:12 pm

Chris12 wrote:North Korea probably doesn't export much to any nation except China


I think the DPRK's only viable export is missile technology. Buyers include other beacons of freedom and tolerance like Syria, Iran, and Venezuela- we'll get no boycott assistance from them.

I really think the situation is a bit more dire than many think. SK will have to save face at some point. They've already tolerated an artillery bombardment and the sinking of a naval ship. Another incident won't go by without serious retalliation. Kim.... don't poke the bear.
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Re: When the bombs fell...

Postby haloguy » Tue Nov 30, 2010 8:05 pm

snobound wrote:
Chris12 wrote:North Korea probably doesn't export much to any nation except China


I think the DPRK's only viable export is missile technology. Buyers include other beacons of freedom and tolerance like Syria, Iran, and Venezuela- we'll get no boycott assistance from them.

I really think the situation is a bit more dire than many think. SK will have to save face at some point. They've already tolerated an artillery bombardment and the sinking of a naval ship. Another incident won't go by without serious retalliation. Kim.... don't poke the bear.


As one japanese general said right as they had just bombed pearl harbor "I am afraid we have just awakened a sleeping giant"

Re: When the bombs fell...

Postby Jason Toddman » Tue Nov 30, 2010 10:41 pm

haloguy wrote: As one japanese general said right as they had just bombed pearl harbor "I am afraid we have just awakened a sleeping giant"


By an interesting coincidence, China has been called that too... or was it a sleeping dragon? Anyway, chances are the Chinese won't let North Korea cause *too* much trouble. As had been said by someone here, China is too interested in gaining the good will of its major trading partners to want too much trouble in that quarter right now. At the same time, North Korea is helping to take the focus off of China's attempt to annex islands previously recognized to be Japanese. Maybe I am reading too much into this, but I don't think the timing of NK's actions to China's are coincidental at all.
Dare to be different... and make a difference.
To boldly go where no one in their right mind has gone before...

Re: When the bombs fell...

Postby Fesselfan » Fri Dec 03, 2010 5:11 am

It's always the same game since WW2. USA and [insert superpower of choice here] have issues with each other but can't go to war because nobody can win a full out war anymore. The look for some poor countries to act as their puppets and start a war there. That's the way things worked in the cold war vs the SU, and that's more or less the same way the USA seems to think now.
Problem: this does not work anymore. All this "north korea can't beat us" salmon here...it's worth nothing. Just imagine...if the US would really start to attack north korea. What could happen:
1) NK uses their nukes, either on south korea or on the US military present there (I won't even go so far as smuggling a small nuke to NY...)
2) The NK are as bad martial wise as people here *claim* they are: the US slaughters an army of 2 millions and then occupies NK. They will loose most of the little respect they have internationally...and posses a country as problematic as the iraq- without the benefit of having oil.
3) They get dragged into a long war, which with each passing year gets harder and harder to explain.

IMHO, there is no way the US can "win" in this scenario. And NK's acting shows they know this.
They rattle their sabres, get attention (and maybe some under the hand deals) and that's it.
Sadly, NK's example shows a basic way which will be followed by many states: if you have nukes, your safe from US hegemony (more or less). :(

Cheers

FF
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