Do u think...

Postby sarobah » Sat Oct 09, 2010 6:25 pm

I am pretty sure I was born with my “kinks” already intact. As far back as I can remember, I fantasized about being the damsel in distress – captured by pirates, kidnapped by spies, etcetera.
Since I didn’t inherit these fantasies from my parents, and I taught my little brother the ropes, I have no idea where they came from. For a long time, I thought they had been implanted by TV, movies and novels, until I realized that it was a chicken-and-egg situation – was I inspired by DiD scenes, or did I seek them out because my fascination already existed?
I guess for most people it’s both nature and nurture – we’re born with certain tendencies, which are either reinforced or suppressed by our circumstances and environment.
~ Sarah
Words, like Nature, half reveal and half conceal the soul within.

Re: Do u think...

Postby Kyle » Sat Oct 09, 2010 6:38 pm

No, fetishes aren't really something "natural." I believe people are born more likely to become involved in kinks than others due to their basic personality, but I have no idea how it would be natural to be turned on by being tied up, to use one example. I would compare it to someone becoming an alcoholic, nature doesn't cause you to become an alcoholic but it can make it more likely for you to become one.

Re: Do u think...

Postby sarobah » Sat Oct 09, 2010 7:19 pm

Kyle wrote:I have no idea how it would be natural to be turned on by being tied up...

From an evolutionary standpoint, I guess it would not be a particularly useful “strategy” for natural selection.
Words, like Nature, half reveal and half conceal the soul within.

Re: Do u think...

Postby Soul_Rebel » Sun Oct 10, 2010 5:31 am

Perhaps it is a bargaining strategy. Masculine men can intimidate women in a relationship with their size and fitness. However, women have limited methods in which to exert a equivalent control over men.

In addition maybe men and women who are more comfortable with trusting their partners (to the extremes as in the case of bondage) carry that phenotype because it's helped them to survive thus far. There's a evolutionary basis for every prevailing behavioral pattern out there so...
Whips and chains may break my bones, but ropes and gags excite me!

The image in my avatar is the work of Vonnart

"Duct tape makes you smart." - Michael Weston

Re: Do u think...

Postby fratboydanny » Sun Oct 10, 2010 5:41 am

sarobah wrote:I am pretty sure I was born with my “kinks” already intact. As far back as I can remember, I fantasized about being the damsel in distress – captured by pirates, kidnapped by spies, etcetera.
Since I didn’t inherit these fantasies from my parents, and I taught my little brother the ropes, I have no idea where they came from. For a long time, I thought they had been implanted by TV, movies and novels, until I realized that it was a chicken-and-egg situation – was I inspired by DiD scenes, or did I seek them out because my fascination already existed?
I guess for most people it’s both nature and nurture – we’re born with certain tendencies, which are either reinforced or suppressed by our circumstances and environment.
~ Sarah



i agree with Sarobah that i think we are born with these kinks and they just manifest themselves at some point in our lives.

now, what i really want to know is how Sarobah taught her brother the ropes.....please, please tell.

Re: Do u think...

Postby Jay Feely » Sun Oct 10, 2010 6:45 am

I do not think that we were born with it. My first tied up experience happened when I was 6 in the 1st grade, but I was not really aroused by it. When I turned 15, and my friend introduced me to the hogtie, instead of hands tied behind back in the 1st grade, I got more interested into being tied up and dominated (friendly or bdsm). After turning 18, and finding sites like tklfrat.com, tickle media forum, teen tickling austrilla, teen tickle, ropejock, and other sites, tickling combined with being tied up was my passion. Than, it was becoming accepting of my fetish when I turned 19, and found stories of tied up games, and other tied up sites, even to going as far as fetlife.com, and joining yahoo tickling and bondage groups. I could not have been born with it. It is through experiences and more diverse the experiences that got me into it.
You will have to subdue me to restrain me. I been a bad boy so make sure you torture me too with anything but pain.

Re: Do u think...

Postby Jason Toddman » Sun Oct 10, 2010 7:04 am

Like Jay, my experiences began early (by age 5 in my case, if not sooner). I wasn't terribly thrilled by it either when I was younger but as I grew older the experiences were frequent (my brother and other older boys) I first learned to get used to it and then gradually to enjoy them since most were positive (captors were friendly, never hurt me, etc). Grew to enjoy them by the time I was 12.
In my case I think there may be a genetic basis but that it takes actual experiences to 'activate' one's liking for Tugs. In my case, my liking for Tugs has bordered on obsession since I was 13!!!
Dare to be different... and make a difference.
To boldly go where no one in their right mind has gone before...

Re: Do u think...

Postby snobound » Sun Oct 10, 2010 11:08 am

sarobah wrote:
Kyle wrote:I have no idea how it would be natural to be turned on by being tied up...

From an evolutionary standpoint, I guess it would not be a particularly useful “strategy” for natural selection.



But think about this... have you ever known a real dullard to have a bondage fetish? Every bondage fanatic I know is quite bright. For me, bondage is an important vehicle for exploring greater depths of my own sensory stimuli, and also a way to access more instinctual, primal emotions. I've done my most introspective thinking while completely immobilized. Maybe the desire to get trussed up is an advantageous trait?
Try out the TUGs chat! http://chat.mibbit.com/#tugsnet

Re: Do u think...

Postby Kyle » Sun Oct 10, 2010 11:30 am

I wasn't really implying anything about evolution in my statement. Being bound is not something you come across naturally, it's artificial.

Re: Do u think...

Postby Jason Toddman » Sun Oct 10, 2010 11:46 am

Kyle wrote:I wasn't really implying anything about evolution in my statement. Being bound is not something you come across naturally, it's artificial.


(1) So is fire, the wheel, and everything we've invented since. Does that make them valueless? :lol:
(2) Artificial or not, Tugs are fun! :mrgreen:
(3) Not to be disgusting, but humans aren't the only animals that use bondage. Just look at spiders and caterpillars, to name two. Not a pretty analogy I admit(sorry), but what the hey... it's natural!!!
Dare to be different... and make a difference.
To boldly go where no one in their right mind has gone before...

Re: Do u think...

Postby Kyle » Sun Oct 10, 2010 12:09 pm

You completely missed the point of what I was saying. Wheels were invented. They aren't natural. No one was born knowing how to invent the wheel, they acquired that knowledge over time. Somebody apparently was born with the ability to do it, but they didn't come out of the womb knowing how to invent a wheel.

You really, really stretched what we're talking about to use spiders and caterpillars as an example.

I agree completely with your #2 point, but that wasn't really what we were discussing. I don't think anyone here would disagree with that, otherwise they wouldn't be here.

Re: Do u think...

Postby snobound » Sun Oct 10, 2010 12:34 pm

Kyle wrote:I wasn't really implying anything about evolution in my statement. Being bound is not something you come across naturally, it's artificial.



Yes, the actual application of restraint is indeed artificial. However, I believe the driving instinct behind these desires to be quite natural. Bondage is just the physical manifestation of these urges. I have clear recollections of bondage-related thoughts as far back as kindergarten (and was likely having them even earlier)...though I guess it's safe to say that I CHOSE bondage as my method to access/satisfy these urges.

However, I believe it's far beyond the ability of anyone on this board to make the determination, without question, whether or not the bondage fetish is an inborn trait.
Try out the TUGs chat! http://chat.mibbit.com/#tugsnet

Re: Do u think...

Postby Jason Toddman » Sun Oct 10, 2010 12:58 pm

Kyle wrote:You completely missed the point of what I was saying. Wheels were invented. They aren't natural. No one was born knowing how to invent the wheel, they acquired that knowledge over time. Somebody apparently was born with the ability to do it, but they didn't come out of the womb knowing how to invent a wheel.

You really, really stretched what we're talking about to use spiders and caterpillars as an example.

I agree completely with your #2 point, but that wasn't really what we were discussing. I don't think anyone here would disagree with that, otherwise they wouldn't be here.


No you completely missed MY point. No one was born knowing how to invent the wheel. But people were born with the smarts so that eventually someone *could* invent the wheel, and then writing, and so on. Also though, I said the wheel was an invention. My point was that something that is not natural by your definition is not necessarily bad. You sound like you feel otherwise.
Fetishes per se may may not be something we are born with - but desire is. All fetishes are simply certain strong desires we've developed in life; usually in childhood. Whether born with it or learned at an early age, who cares? They're just as real and as valid either way.

As for stretching things with the spiders and caterpillars, by whose definition? Yours?
Quit telling people you don't agree with that they're stretching things will you? It's getting really, really annoying having you call my (or anyone's) opinions valueless.
Dare to be different... and make a difference.
To boldly go where no one in their right mind has gone before...

Re: Do u think...

Postby Kyle » Sun Oct 10, 2010 4:52 pm

Jason Toddman wrote:
Kyle wrote:You completely missed the point of what I was saying. Wheels were invented. They aren't natural. No one was born knowing how to invent the wheel, they acquired that knowledge over time. Somebody apparently was born with the ability to do it, but they didn't come out of the womb knowing how to invent a wheel.

You really, really stretched what we're talking about to use spiders and caterpillars as an example.

I agree completely with your #2 point, but that wasn't really what we were discussing. I don't think anyone here would disagree with that, otherwise they wouldn't be here.


No you completely missed MY point. No one was born knowing how to invent the wheel. But people were born with the smarts so that eventually someone *could* invent the wheel, and then writing, and so on. Also though, I said the wheel was an invention. My point was that something that is not natural by your definition is not necessarily bad. You sound like you feel otherwise.
Fetishes per se may may not be something we are born with - but desire is. All fetishes are simply certain strong desires we've developed in life; usually in childhood. Whether born with it or learned at an early age, who cares? They're just as real and as valid either way.

As for stretching things with the spiders and caterpillars, by whose definition? Yours?
Quit telling people you don't agree with that they're stretching things will you? It's getting really, really annoying having you call my (or anyone's) opinions valueless.


Okay, let's get a few things straight here so we don't have any more misunderstandings than have already taken place.

1. I think we pretty much said the same thing on being born with ability, but somehow are coming at different conclusions about whether or not we're born having our particular kinks or interests. I guess we're defining "being born with it" differently. I personally take it to mean you're immediately being born having the kinks already in place. Maybe I was a bit forceful in saying you missed my point entirely, but we're definitely not on the same page here.
2. I never once said your opinion was valueless. Caterpillars and spiders do not do bondage remotely for the reasons we're discussing here. That should be obvious. This is what I meant by it being a stretch. I didn't honestly think I'd have to explain any of this. If disagreement to you is making your opinion worthless, maybe you shouldn't be commenting on threads like this. I really don't see how you can compare a spider wrapping up prey to eat to anything remotely similar to having kinks and interests in tie-up games but that's just me.
3. For someone who doesn't want others to tell him what to do or think or act you sure have an issue doing that yourself to others.

I'll admit I probably shouldn't have said that about you missing my point entirely. Reading back over it now it did come out a little strong. But let's not get completely ridiculous here.

Re: Do u think...

Postby Scottstud94 » Sun Oct 10, 2010 8:57 pm

Caterpillars and Spiders into TUGS? I am hoping my new hamster will be into bondage as well! This conversation is officially off-track. As for the real question... I believe you are born with them and as you grow up they come out or regress.

Re: Do u think...

Postby Jason Toddman » Sun Oct 10, 2010 9:22 pm

Scottstud94 wrote:Caterpillars and Spiders into TUGS? I am hoping my new hamster will be into bondage as well! This conversation is officially off-track. As for the real question... I believe you are born with them and as you grow up they come out or regress.


That last was exacty the point I was trying to make, Scottstud94.. Thank you.
As for Kyle, your constant carping about things being off topic is what I refer to when saying you seem to find other peoples' opinions valueless. Your suggestion about maybe my not commenting on these threads is just another example of this, ans is NOT appreciated.
A spider ties things up. I never said its motivation was the same. A caterpilar ties itself up. Same thing, different motivation.
Also, it was a joke. Develop a sense of humor, will you?
And throwing what I said about disagreements back at me doesn't invalidate what I said. Don't be a hippocrite.
And as for "For someone who doesn't want others to tell him what to do or think or act you sure have an issue doing that yourself to others" - how do you figure I am doing that, other than to ask you to stop dissing other people?
Dare to be different... and make a difference.
To boldly go where no one in their right mind has gone before...

Re: Do u think...

Postby sarobah » Sun Oct 10, 2010 10:48 pm

Words, like Nature, half reveal and half conceal the soul within.

Re: Do u think...

Postby sarobah » Sun Oct 10, 2010 10:51 pm

Kyle wrote:I wasn't really implying anything about evolution in my statement.

I confess I was being facetious.
~ Sarah
Words, like Nature, half reveal and half conceal the soul within.

Re: Do u think...

Postby xtc » Mon Oct 11, 2010 12:40 am

Scottstud,
You'd stand more chance with a pet boa constrictor than a hamster!
Boxer shorts are cool,
but little speedos rule!

More by the same author: viewtopic.php?f=5&t=22729

Re: Do u think...

Postby cellofello » Mon Oct 11, 2010 4:47 am

I believe I was born with the interest. I can remember wanting to be tied up as young as four years old. While I might have first caught the idea from some TV show, I don't know how just seeing it in a non-erotic context (like a western where someone was tied up by the bad guys) would teach me to eroticize it and desire it. Yet just learning about the idea of being tied up made me want to experience it.

On the other hand, I remember one woman I introduced to bondage in her 40s. She was interested in me, so she was willing to try it - and found that she really enjoyed being tied up. I'm sure she had heard about it before. But she didn't have any desire to try it herself until she met someone she was romantically interested in (i.e., me) who proposed the idea. For that reason I would put it down as learned behavior in her case.

So I would say that there is no general answer that's true for all people. Some are born to want it; others are born to hate it; some will learn to like it if introduced in a pleasurable context; yet another group will simply be indifferent no matter what. (I.e., they might be willing to tie or be tied to please a partner, but they get nothing out of the bondage itself.)

Re: Do u think...

Postby Kyle » Tue Oct 12, 2010 1:10 pm

Jason Toddman wrote:
Scottstud94 wrote:Caterpillars and Spiders into TUGS? I am hoping my new hamster will be into bondage as well! This conversation is officially off-track. As for the real question... I believe you are born with them and as you grow up they come out or regress.


That last was exacty the point I was trying to make, Scottstud94.. Thank you.
As for Kyle, your constant carping about things being off topic is what I refer to when saying you seem to find other peoples' opinions valueless. Your suggestion about maybe my not commenting on these threads is just another example of this, ans is NOT appreciated.
A spider ties things up. I never said its motivation was the same. A caterpilar ties itself up. Same thing, different motivation.
Also, it was a joke. Develop a sense of humor, will you?
And throwing what I said about disagreements back at me doesn't invalidate what I said. Don't be a hippocrite.
And as for "For someone who doesn't want others to tell him what to do or think or act you sure have an issue doing that yourself to others" - how do you figure I am doing that, other than to ask you to stop dissing other people?


I'm assuming you're talking about my comments on some of the threads about politics in the Jump in the Fire section as I can't recall any other threads I said anything like that on. I don't normally like to discuss topics from different threads on other threads but I'm going to make an exception for this case. I thought I'd explained it over there but I'll do it again. When you have a political debate and several people make comments like "Quit watching Glenn Beck/Fox News" and things like that without it having a single thing to do with the conversation, it is childish and at that point if I feel like calling it out, I will. I don't know if you said it or not; I'm not going back just to look up who did and didn't say it. I normally do respect others' opinions regardless of what you may think, but I don't respect people who bring up crap like that. If anything, it shows you really don't have a leg to stand on and are grasping at straws to try to discredit the other person. It really should be something I just let go and assume the person making those comments is an idiot, but I see it so much everywhere I get annoyed by it and so far have felt compelled to bring it up here.

I'm not really sure why this came up, as I never said anyone here was off-topic, but I figured while it was up here I'd address it. I did say you missed my point (true or not) but that isn't quite the same thing.

As for the whole deal about telling others what to do, I think your comments on the thread about where to buy toys and such (forgot the actual thread title) is a pretty good example of that.
Last edited by Kyle on Tue Oct 12, 2010 1:20 pm, edited 1 time in total.

Re: Do u think...

Postby Kyle » Tue Oct 12, 2010 1:11 pm

sarobah wrote:
Kyle wrote:I wasn't really implying anything about evolution in my statement.

I confess I was being facetious.
~ Sarah


I kind of wondered if you were, but I couldn't tell from the comment.

Re: Do u think...

Postby Kyle » Tue Oct 12, 2010 1:12 pm

snobound wrote:
Kyle wrote:I wasn't really implying anything about evolution in my statement. Being bound is not something you come across naturally, it's artificial.



Yes, the actual application of restraint is indeed artificial. However, I believe the driving instinct behind these desires to be quite natural. Bondage is just the physical manifestation of these urges.



I would agree with this. It was a lot like what I was trying to say, but you put it in better words than I did.

Re: Do u think...

Postby Jason Toddman » Tue Oct 12, 2010 2:38 pm

Kyle wrote:[As for the whole deal about telling others what to do, I think your comments on the thread about where to buy toys and such (forgot the actual thread title) is a pretty good example of that.

WTF?!?
What you quoted from me was me answering a question suggesting where the questioner (Josh) could find supplies.
What you implied earlier on the other hand is that I try to order people around. This is hardly the same thing. I certainly wasn't giving Josh orders, now was I?!
Dare to be different... and make a difference.
To boldly go where no one in their right mind has gone before...

Re: Do u think...

Postby fratboydanny » Wed Oct 13, 2010 3:38 pm

thanks, Sara, for the links. those stories are great and i loved seeing how you younger brother was involved. that had to be fun.

as for the topic at hand, what if a guy or girl starts to self pleasure themselves to the thought of Tugs not even knowing what they are doing. but, by the time they learn what they are doing they realize that whenever they self pleasure, they are ALWAYS doing it to the thought of Tugs either by themselves or thinking about being in a Tug with another person. so, is this learned or are they born with it?

i can ask this question because "protected" as i was, this was my situation.

Re: Do u think...

Postby Jason Toddman » Wed Oct 13, 2010 3:58 pm

That definitely sounds learned to me. I am a tad similar, bit in my case, it wasn't Tugs that I think of when I 'pleasure myself'... it was, still is, and always has been to the thought of being sat on - or more likely to being sat on while I was tied up. Honest. That's how much I like being sat on! How's that for kooky? But I think that was learned, not genetic. I didn't start 'pleasuring myself' on a regular basis until I'd spent my first summer being sat on by my cousins and their friends either (apparently by modern standards that makes me a late starter), and this may have a lot to do with it. Whereas I began Tugs when I was 5 and Tugs alone never seemed particularly sexual to me. The physical contact of being sat on however is strongly sexual to me, I suppose... though it took me an amazingly long time to realize this.
Dare to be different... and make a difference.
To boldly go where no one in their right mind has gone before...

Re: Do u think...

Postby Kyle » Thu Oct 14, 2010 1:53 pm

Jason Toddman wrote:
Kyle wrote:[As for the whole deal about telling others what to do, I think your comments on the thread about where to buy toys and such (forgot the actual thread title) is a pretty good example of that.

WTF?!?
What you quoted from me was me answering a question suggesting where the questioner (Josh) could find supplies.
What you implied earlier on the other hand is that I try to order people around. This is hardly the same thing. I certainly wasn't giving Josh orders, now was I?!


"Ordering" is a bit strong of a word here, but you definitely told him what he needed to start doing.

Re: Do u think...

Postby Kyle » Thu Oct 14, 2010 1:55 pm

fratboydanny wrote:thanks, Sara, for the links. those stories are great and i loved seeing how you younger brother was involved. that had to be fun.

as for the topic at hand, what if a guy or girl starts to self pleasure themselves to the thought of Tugs not even knowing what they are doing. but, by the time they learn what they are doing they realize that whenever they self pleasure, they are ALWAYS doing it to the thought of Tugs either by themselves or thinking about being in a Tug with another person. so, is this learned or are they born with it?

i can ask this question because "protected" as i was, this was my situation.


I think this sounds learned too. It develops and changes over time but stems from a beginning.

Re: Do u think...

Postby Jason Toddman » Thu Oct 14, 2010 2:03 pm

Kyle wrote:
Jason Toddman wrote:
Kyle wrote:[As for the whole deal about telling others what to do, I think your comments on the thread about where to buy toys and such (forgot the actual thread title) is a pretty good example of that.

WTF?!?
What you quoted from me was me answering a question suggesting where the questioner (Josh) could find supplies.
What you implied earlier on the other hand is that I try to order people around. This is hardly the same thing. I certainly wasn't giving Josh orders, now was I?!


"Ordering" is a bit strong of a word here, but you definitely told him what he needed to start doing.


And I think you're full of it!!! :x
Dare to be different... and make a difference.
To boldly go where no one in their right mind has gone before...

Re: Do u think...

Postby Scottstud94 » Thu Oct 14, 2010 8:12 pm

Alright let's not argue here...