Drawing the line on child abuse

Postby Jay Feely » Mon Sep 29, 2014 6:54 pm

Where does corporal punishment become child abuse?
You will have to subdue me to restrain me. I been a bad boy so make sure you torture me too with anything but pain.

Re: Drawing the line on child abuse

Postby mcsproot » Mon Sep 29, 2014 7:20 pm

Corporal punishment is more about the humiliation than the actual pain.

If you think about it, a couple of smacks to the butt isn't anything to write home about. Having that take place in front of your friends, your siblings, or in a public place (eg acting up in a restaurant) would be incredibly humiliating.

It would also cross the line into child abuse if it was inappropriate. You'd give a child a smack if they were constantly misbehaving after several warnings about it. You wouldn't slap a child in the face because they accidentally dropped their fork while eating (which if you did, they probably did because they were shaking in fear so much).
23 year old guy from the UK.

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Re: Drawing the line on child abuse

Postby NemesisPrime » Mon Sep 29, 2014 7:38 pm

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ESBCX7nIMV0

Just to add more fuel to the fire. I was spanked as a kid though I've turned out okay I think...Aside form being extremely nice.
Everyone speaks in multiple languages...But gag talk is universal and a sock in your mouth is the perfect translator!

Re: Drawing the line on child abuse

Postby mikeybound » Mon Sep 29, 2014 8:49 pm

Maybe it's just an opinion, but all corporal is abuse. If it isn't about the physical pain, then the humiliation is emotional abuse.
Any misbehavior has an ideal punishment to suit the child. If they have problems in restaurants, go out fewer times or to places they don't like. If they're addicted to something, restrict that. If they fight with siblings, force them to work out their differences. Hell, I'd even be okay with biting them if they do it to other people all the time, just to show them the pain they're causing. And of course, you can always treat the child like a cognitively functioning human being and explain what they did.
The problem is, a lot of parents and guardians can't come up with anything more creative than a few whacks to the bum. Not counting the fact that there really isn't any regulation on the severity, behaviors like this are psychologically addictive. The more you strike a child, the more you may actually want to do so. Anyone who said they turned out just fine and love their parents need to experience more than a few light smacks every now and than. Spankings could be a gateway to stuff that most anyone would consider child abuse. Meanwhile, ineffectual attempts at more constructive corrective behavior is viewed as weak, when it might work better if the parents understood their children or the situation more.
I, honestly sick of people treating spankings like they're harmless when they could very well get out of hand. More than that, I'm tired of sending the message that if you do something wrong, you'll get struck and humiliated, or that this is how you should respond to people who disappoint you.

Re: Drawing the line on child abuse

Postby skybird137 » Mon Sep 29, 2014 11:07 pm

Jay Feely wrote:Where does corporal punishment become child abuse?



In the eyes of the person inflicting the punishment, it is never child abuse, no matter how far they go.

Re: Drawing the line on child abuse

Postby jsherwood » Wed Oct 08, 2014 12:53 pm

Jay Feely wrote:Where does corporal punishment become child abuse?


when it is too often and conducted on one over aged? But there are blurry lines on how to and when to start and whether it is effective vs other methods: scolding, grounding, removal of privileges etc. As a girl, it was scary on me. Did it work? Yes and no. Was I over aged when it stopped? Depends.

Re: Drawing the line on child abuse

Postby Scottstud94 » Wed Oct 08, 2014 2:06 pm

I believe we should bring back the old ways of punishment.

If a kids being mouthy, tape their mouth shut.
If a kid is trying to hit another kid, tie him to a chair
If a kid is sleepwalking and breaking stuff, chain him to a bed.

Now before you freak out and say that's not safe, hush. Safety is important, and don't tie them up unwillingly.


Punishments have gotten so soft these days. When I was young, my parents would ground me. I snuck out once and ever since then if I was grounded they used a chain and secured me somewhere.

Safety is important, don't leave them alone, or gagged for long periods of time. No you can't abuse a kid, but if the child agrees to it (which I did), you should be able to tie them up.

If that's the best punishment that's agreed too between all parties.

Re: Drawing the line on child abuse

Postby NemesisPrime » Wed Oct 08, 2014 2:47 pm

Scottstud94 wrote:I believe we should bring back the old ways of punishment.

If a kids being mouthy, tape their mouth shut.
If a kid is trying to hit another kid, tie him to a chair
If a kid is sleepwalking and breaking stuff, chain him to a bed.

Now before you freak out and say that's not safe, hush. Safety is important, and don't tie them up unwillingly.


Punishments have gotten so soft these days. When I was young, my parents would ground me. I snuck out once and ever since then if I was grounded they used a chain and secured me somewhere.

Safety is important, don't leave them alone, or gagged for long periods of time. No you can't abuse a kid, but if the child agrees to it (which I did), you should be able to tie them up.

If that's the best punishment that's agreed too between all parties.


That's assuming the child agrees and I don't think they will...
Everyone speaks in multiple languages...But gag talk is universal and a sock in your mouth is the perfect translator!

Re: Drawing the line on child abuse

Postby skybird137 » Wed Oct 08, 2014 2:52 pm

I believe we should bring back the old ways of punishment.


If you believe that your list was the old ways of punishment, then you must have a very soft few of the past.


Old ways is being beaten as long and as hard as possible by your punisher who only stops when their arm gets tired.

Old ways is being hit across the head so hard that you are knocked off your feet.

Old ways is having something hard thrown at your face so that it gashes your head open.

Old ways is having someone grab hold of your tie, sharply pull your head down and then jab their fist up into your throat.

Re: Drawing the line on child abuse

Postby jsherwood » Wed Oct 08, 2014 2:58 pm

skybird137 wrote:
I believe we should bring back the old ways of punishment.


If you believe that your list was the old ways of punishment, then you must have a very soft few of the past.


Old ways is being beaten as long and as hard as possible by your punisher who only stops when their arm gets tired.

Old ways is being hit across the head so hard that you are knocked off your feet.

Old ways is having something hard thrown at your face so that it gashes your head open.

Old ways is having someone grab hold of your tie, sharply pull your head down and then jab their fist up into your throat.


some still stick with the old (not all old forms but one or two) in modern times, get away with it, their children grow up, and arent affected. Some are affected some aren't

Re: Drawing the line on child abuse

Postby xtc » Wed Oct 08, 2014 3:36 pm

Why not really re-institute the old systems and hang small children by their wrists but only once they have been tied behind them?
Come on, get real. The example I have given IS genuine and was employed in factories (and, I think, in workhouses).
All physical abuse of children is just that: abuse.
Anyone who thinks otherwise has obviously not had to stand between a (huge and violent) father, whose time in front of the telly had been interrupted, and his terrified daughter who was in trouble in school. I have.
Boxer shorts are cool,
but little speedos rule!

More by the same author: viewtopic.php?f=5&t=22729

Re: Drawing the line on child abuse

Postby jsherwood » Thu Oct 09, 2014 12:10 am

xtc wrote:Why not really re-institute the old systems and hang small children by their wrists but only once they have been tied behind them?
Come on, get real. The example I have given IS genuine and was employed in factories (and, I think, in workhouses).
All physical abuse of children is just that: abuse.
Anyone who thinks otherwise has obviously not had to stand between a (huge and violent) father, whose time in front of the telly had been interrupted, and his terrified daughter who was in trouble in school. I have.


Dont go to extremes. Why not regulate everything in this world? Why ban smoking? Why not ban drugs? Things cant be undone.

Re: Drawing the line on child abuse

Postby drawscore » Thu Oct 09, 2014 9:32 pm

I got my butt swatted a couple of times in the 8th grade by the Dean of Boys at my junior high school. It definitely discouraged the behavior complained about by the referring teacher, and was not repeated.

Deawscore

Re: Drawing the line on child abuse

Postby jsherwood » Fri Oct 10, 2014 1:57 am

drawscore wrote:I got my butt swatted a couple of times in the 8th grade by the Dean of Boys at my junior high school. It definitely discouraged the behavior complained about by the referring teacher, and was not repeated.

Deawscore


it's banned to cane girls and boys in school where I am. But not exactly at home.

Re: Drawing the line on child abuse

Postby Scottstud94 » Fri Oct 10, 2014 6:12 am

Wanna get a kid to start listening to what you say?

- chain them to their bed until they start begging and pleading to use the bathroom. Don't let them, and once they are forced to wet themselves I guarentee they'll listen to you from now on

Re: Drawing the line on child abuse

Postby truly_trussed » Fri Oct 10, 2014 6:56 am

drawscore wrote:I got my butt swatted a couple of times in the 8th grade by the Dean of Boys at my junior high school. It definitely discouraged the behavior complained about by the referring teacher, and was not repeated.

Deawscore


DS- You really are from the U.S. Deep South! CP is still permitted in parts of 19 states, mostly in the South and South-Central states. Of the nation's
100 largest school districts it's allowed in 3 of them. It's primarily in the boondocks, the hinterlands and other rural areas.

Banning CP in the US is a relatively recent phenomen. The first state to ban was New Jersey in something like 1857. The next state to ban it was Massachusetts in 1972!

Also DS, did your school's Dean of Girls paddle (or as they say in the regional vernacular "whupp") them too?

If you don't mind me asking Drawscore, what was your transgression? :spank;

Re: Drawing the line on child abuse

Postby drawscore » Fri Oct 10, 2014 7:42 pm

I managed to piss off the teacher. I asked aloud if anyone knew what happened when the old lady backed in to the airplane propeller. The answer was "disaster."

Drawscore

Re: Drawing the line on child abuse

Postby jsherwood » Sat Oct 11, 2014 1:40 am

drawscore wrote:I managed to piss off the teacher. I asked aloud if anyone knew what happened when the old lady backed in to the airplane propeller. The answer was "disaster."

Drawscore


what instrument did they use?

Re: Drawing the line on child abuse

Postby drawscore » Sat Oct 11, 2014 8:26 pm

A paddle. And, as far as I know, the Dean of Girls also had a paddle, and used it.

Drawscore

Re: Drawing the line on child abuse

Postby mikeybound » Sat Oct 11, 2014 10:12 pm

drawscore wrote:I managed to piss off the teacher. I asked aloud if anyone knew what happened when the old lady backed in to the airplane propeller. The answer was "disaster."

Drawscore

They took a paddle to you for...having a sense of humor? Seriously? People make careers off jokes like that!

Re: Drawing the line on child abuse

Postby truly_trussed » Sun Oct 12, 2014 7:12 am

I'd like to know what the guidelines are for CP where it's still legal. Suppose the School Disciplinarian had a spanking fetish. I could picture he or she meeting with the Superintendent, "What, I can't use a rubber-ball gag?" :spank; :gag:

Re: Drawing the line on child abuse

Postby jsherwood » Sun Oct 12, 2014 7:32 am

you luck/unlucky sods getting it in school. Some teachers/parents and even students in the UK think it should be brought back to school here.

Re: Drawing the line on child abuse

Postby truly_trussed » Sun Oct 12, 2014 8:09 am

JS- England used to do CP big time, especially caning. (XTC advised me Scotland has a different system). I believe CP was in the theme of some Pink Floyd songs.

If I'm wrong correct me but that ended in the public (state) schools in 1983 and private schools in 1998. Still many British school alumni developed a CP fetish, at least for blokes. It's not for those under 18 but check the website of Boyz and Sirs.(Warning, lots of nudity, mainly asses or arses). Again, not for those under 18 years of age. It's a London Club where every Saturday afternoon guys go wearing adult school uniforms, scout unis, PE and Team Sport unis and they get caned or paddled. AFAIK there's no bondage. Since CP is no longer in English schools this uniquely British kink will probably die off as the Caned Generations age.Call it the Cane Mutiny! (Sorry, couldn't resist that.

I can't remember if it was this site where a London area member went there or maybe another site when I first read about it.. I hope I'm not too OT. This place involves consenting adults and not children but those childhood experiences often continue into adulthood.I also wonder if British women would visit a female equivalent CP club with Uniforms.

I also recall an interview (before the internet) from a Southern California dominatrix. She frequently would cane British expatriates or tourists who live or visit in nearby Santa Monica, a popular U.K. destination. T.T.

Re: Drawing the line on child abuse

Postby jsherwood » Sun Oct 12, 2014 9:06 am

truly_trussed wrote:JS- England used to do CP big time, especially caning. (XTC advised me Scotland has a different system). I believe CP was in the theme of some Pink Floyd songs.

If I'm wrong correct me but that ended in the public (state) schools in 1983 and private schools in 1998. Still many British school alumni developed a CP fetish, at least for blokes. It's not for those under 18 but check the website of Boyz and Sirs.(Warning, lots of nudity, mainly asses or arses). Again, not for those under 18 years of age. It's a London Club where every Saturday afternoon guys go wearing adult school uniforms, scout unis, PE and Team Sport unis and they get caned or paddled. AFAIK there's no bondage. Since CP is no longer in English schools this uniquely British kink will probably die off as the Caned Generations age.Call it the Cane Mutiny! (Sorry, couldn't resist that.

I can't remember if it was this site where a London area member went there or maybe another site when I first read about it.. I hope I'm not too OT. This place involves consenting adults and not children but those childhood experiences often continue into adulthood.I also wonder if British women would visit a female equivalent CP club with Uniforms.

I also recall an interview (before the internet) from a Southern California dominatrix. She frequently would cane British expatriates or tourists who live or visit in nearby Santa Monica, a popular U.K. destination. T.T.


Well there definitely wasn't caning in my school. And detentions didn't always discipline boys and girls.

Re: Drawing the line on child abuse

Postby Plueschbabycd » Sun Oct 12, 2014 11:46 am

Hello In Germany is corporal punishment declare by law that is child abuse. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Corporal_punishment
Your can really get great problems if cam out that you smack or spanking your children. As I hear is in USA not surprised. I hear it from German Au Pair where guest family was normal to do corporal punishment.
Andrew
"Don“t dream it, be it." Dr. Frank N. Furter in Rocky Horror Picture Show

Re: Drawing the line on child abuse

Postby jsherwood » Mon Oct 13, 2014 12:20 pm

Do non-caning/spanking methods work better than caning/spanking?

Re: Drawing the line on child abuse

Postby mikeybound » Mon Oct 13, 2014 12:55 pm

jsherwood wrote:Do non-caning/spanking methods work better than caning/spanking?

I don't think there's any way to prove that off the top of our heads, but if there're any parents who prefer corporal to other methods, I think we know weather that's abuse or not.

Re: Drawing the line on child abuse

Postby FelixSH » Mon Oct 13, 2014 2:30 pm

I don't see how it is ok to physically hurt a child when it is not for adults (as there are no crimes where this is used as a punishment). Physically hurting others is nothing else than bullying, and personally I think that every time parents punish there kids that way they have failed. Neither me nor my siblings or cousins were physically hurt for punishment, and we all are well adjusted adults. I also think that by using physical force with your children, you teach them that it is ok to do that if someone doesn't behave in the right way. Not a good lesson to teach.

In short, I think corporal punishment is always abuse.

Re: Drawing the line on child abuse

Postby mikeybound » Mon Oct 13, 2014 3:28 pm

Very good point Felix. You could be a murderer, rapist, and insurance scammer, and the cops still aren't supposed to lay a hand on you unless you're an immediate danger to someone. Personally, I think that if authority isn't allowed to lay a hand on the scum of the earth, that same protection should extend to a child.
Of course, you could go the opposite route and say that cops should beat people in interrogations. Please do.

Re: Drawing the line on child abuse

Postby jsherwood » Tue Oct 14, 2014 5:51 am

mikeybound wrote:
jsherwood wrote:Do non-caning/spanking methods work better than caning/spanking?

I don't think there's any way to prove that off the top of our heads, but if there're any parents who prefer corporal to other methods, I think we know weather that's abuse or not.


exactly. There's no way to prove either way. Verbal shouting can also still cause psychological damage or maybe not to to child later on in life.