The Manhattan Beach Project. A Cure for Death by Aging?

Postby mikeybound » Thu Jan 31, 2013 10:19 am

What do you think of it? Do you think it's possible? Would any of you even want this? I don't wanna talk about this with people in real life, because aging might be a touchy subject.

http://www.manhattanbeachproject.com/

Re: The Manhattan Beach Project. A Cure for Death by Aging?

Postby Chris12 » Thu Jan 31, 2013 11:26 am

Overpopulation here we come! :big:

It sounds awesome but very impractical. If half the world use's that technology then we won't have enough room on this earth anymore. And if we restrict it to a select few it would be very unfair.

Re: The Manhattan Beach Project. A Cure for Death by Aging?

Postby mikeybound » Thu Jan 31, 2013 11:34 am

Chris12 wrote:Overpopulation here we come! :big:

It sounds awesome but very impractical. If half the world use's that technology then we won't have enough room on this earth anymore. And if we restrict it to a select few it would be very unfair.

Well, we'd still have a death rate. Suicides, accidents, murders, wars, and natural disasters would effect the population. Also, if one literally had all the time in the world, we wouldn't be in such a hurry to have kids. A family could be built over decades or centuries, not years.
I'm not saying it wouldn't be tough at first, but change takes some growing pains.

Re: The Manhattan Beach Project. A Cure for Death by Aging?

Postby Zandor » Thu Jan 31, 2013 11:51 am

Mikey you have a point but what if it goes wrong?9
You are q immortal

Re: The Manhattan Beach Project. A Cure for Death by Aging?

Postby mikeybound » Thu Jan 31, 2013 11:54 am

There are 2 deaths per second from old age. Either we try, fail and put it behind us, or let doubt and fear paralyze us. Maybe it won't work, but I believe we have the right to try.

Re: The Manhattan Beach Project. A Cure for Death by Aging?

Postby the other one » Thu Jan 31, 2013 2:56 pm

This is a stupid idea. Only those who can pay it, will live longer. And this are mostly those people who don't deserve it. Maybe in the further future this could be used meaningful.
“Collective fear stimulates herd instinct, and tends to produce ferocity toward those who are not regarded as members of the herd.”


Bertrand Russell

Re: The Manhattan Beach Project. A Cure for Death by Aging?

Postby mikeybound » Thu Jan 31, 2013 2:59 pm

the other one wrote:This is a stupid idea. Only those who can pay it, will live longer. And this are mostly those people who don't deserve it. Maybe in the further future this could be used meaningful.

Well, it might not cost that much. Even if it cost more than you make in a year, you'd have a looooong time to make up the difference :big: . Also, are you saying that the rich are bad people? That's like saying a complete stranger deserves to die.

Re: The Manhattan Beach Project. A Cure for Death by Aging?

Postby the other one » Thu Jan 31, 2013 3:38 pm

mikeybound wrote:
the other one wrote:This is a stupid idea. Only those who can pay it, will live longer. And this are mostly those people who don't deserve it. Maybe in the further future this could be used meaningful.

Well, it might not cost that much. Even if it cost more than you make in a year, you'd have a looooong time to make up the difference :big: . Also, are you saying that the rich are bad people? That's like saying a complete stranger deserves to die.


I didn't say they are bad people. I said, most of them didn't deserve it.
But her just some examples of people who don't deserve it.

People who steal legally money by the banking system.
People who bring war to the world.
People who want to poison the people.
People who make other people dependend to a drug.
People who want to control the world.
People who's only sense of life is money.
People who only want power.


Most of the rich people are at least one of those.
“Collective fear stimulates herd instinct, and tends to produce ferocity toward those who are not regarded as members of the herd.”


Bertrand Russell

Re: The Manhattan Beach Project. A Cure for Death by Aging?

Postby mikeybound » Thu Jan 31, 2013 3:48 pm

How about people who do deserve it? Great scientists, humanitarians. One could even deserve it just because they've done nothing particularly good or bad. However, if we're not killing these people outright, that means they have the right to live, so saying these people don't deserve such boons is a bit unfair.

Re: The Manhattan Beach Project. A Cure for Death by Aging?

Postby Kyle » Thu Jan 31, 2013 5:59 pm

the other one wrote:
mikeybound wrote:
the other one wrote:This is a stupid idea. Only those who can pay it, will live longer. And this are mostly those people who don't deserve it. Maybe in the further future this could be used meaningful.

Well, it might not cost that much. Even if it cost more than you make in a year, you'd have a looooong time to make up the difference :big: . Also, are you saying that the rich are bad people? That's like saying a complete stranger deserves to die.


I didn't say they are bad people. I said, most of them didn't deserve it.
But her just some examples of people who don't deserve it.

People who steal legally money by the banking system.
People who bring war to the world.
People who want to poison the people.
People who make other people dependend to a drug.
People who want to control the world.
People who's only sense of life is money.
People who only want power.


Most of the rich people are at least one of those.


Judge, jury, and executioner for the rich right here. The ironic thing is you'd probably be condemning the very people behind this research.

As for myself, I don't think you'll ever beat death, and don't really understand the desire to live forever (or a very long time, in this case). Old people generally have a ton of health problems and see people around them die off. I don't really like the idea of 140 years of senility.

Re: The Manhattan Beach Project. A Cure for Death by Aging?

Postby Jason Toddman » Thu Jan 31, 2013 6:11 pm

I think this is an interesting discussion; what moral problems would come about through such a discovery?
Unfortunately, I think the whole matter is moot. This entire ad is nothing more than a crock of s**t; meant to con the gullible out of their money to invest in this 'discovery'. I am all but certain that there is nothing to this whatsoever. If there had been any 'magic bullets' to counter aging discovered, we'd have all heard about it by now from a far more reliable source of information than this appears to be. I'd say, forget about it.
Of course, the fact that I am likely too old to get any good out of this even were it the real deal has nothing to do with my disbelief, lest someone accuse of me the old sour grapes syndrome.
Dare to be different... and make a difference.
To boldly go where no one in their right mind has gone before...

Re: The Manhattan Beach Project. A Cure for Death by Aging?

Postby Kyle » Thu Jan 31, 2013 6:16 pm

Jason Toddman wrote:I think this is an interesting discussion; what moral problems would come about through such a discovery?
Unfortunately, I think the whole matter is moot. This entire ad is nothing more than a crock of s**t; meant to con the gullible out of their money to invest in this 'discovery'. I am all but certain that there is nothing to this whatsoever. If there had been any 'magic bullets' to counter aging discovered, we'd have all heard about it by now from a far more reliable source of information than this appears to be. I'd say, forget about it.
Of course, the fact that I am likely too old to get any good out of this even were it the real deal has nothing to do with my disbelief, lest someone accuse of me the old sour grapes syndrome.


I'm pretty sure you're 100% right on this one. I have to admit I did only glance at the site when posting above which was a rather stupid thing to do. After looking at it closer they may as well have told me my Nigerian uncle left me $42 million. Though it does not change anything I said above on the issue.

Re: The Manhattan Beach Project. A Cure for Death by Aging?

Postby mikeybound » Thu Jan 31, 2013 6:46 pm

As for myself, I don't think you'll ever beat death, and don't really understand the desire to live forever (or a very long time, in this case). Old people generally have a ton of health problems and see people around them die off. I don't really like the idea of 140 years of senility.

The entire point is eternal health. Reason says that if one stays healthy, one lives better. Indefinite life would just be a side effect.

Re: The Manhattan Beach Project. A Cure for Death by Aging?

Postby mikeybound » Thu Jan 31, 2013 6:48 pm

So it really is fake? :-(

Re: The Manhattan Beach Project. A Cure for Death by Aging?

Postby Jason Toddman » Thu Jan 31, 2013 6:53 pm

mikeybound wrote:So it really is fake? :-(

The ad is bogus; the concept isn't necessarily so however. Perhaps science will eventually find a way to prolong life and increase general health in the kinds of leaps and bounds you're thinking about instead of the slow increments it's been doing for the past two centuries. But as for this ad, it's pure snake oil. Nothing more. I know enough about current scientific discoveries and I've seen enough other so-called announcements of something great to know baloney when I see it.
Dare to be different... and make a difference.
To boldly go where no one in their right mind has gone before...

Re: The Manhattan Beach Project. A Cure for Death by Aging?

Postby mikeybound » Thu Jan 31, 2013 7:02 pm

Well, I don't know. 60 years ago space travel, the Internet, and Skype were considered impossible. I've yet to find the words 'scam', and 'Manhattan Beach Project' used together until you Toddman. Until that time, at least I have hope.

Re: The Manhattan Beach Project. A Cure for Death by Aging?

Postby Jason Toddman » Thu Jan 31, 2013 7:26 pm

mikeybound wrote:Well, I don't know. 60 years ago space travel, the Internet, and Skype were considered impossible.

True, but that was 60 years ago. 60 years from now, this Manhattan Beach project business may be a reality.
For now however and for the foreseeable future though, it is NOT.

mikeybound wrote:I've yet to find the words 'scam', and 'Manhattan Beach Project' used together until you Toddman. Until that time, at least I have hope.

That's fine. Hope is good. Hope is vital for mental health.
But there is a fine line between hope and gullibility. If you contact this place and they ask you for money or something, say "Hell, no!"
Dare to be different... and make a difference.
To boldly go where no one in their right mind has gone before...

Re: The Manhattan Beach Project. A Cure for Death by Aging?

Postby mikeybound » Thu Jan 31, 2013 7:37 pm

Believe me, I know. I just meant that if this really was a scam, I'd have found something. And I looked, too. I'm not discounting this until a reliable source says, in no uncertain terms, that it is fake.

Re: The Manhattan Beach Project. A Cure for Death by Aging?

Postby Jason Toddman » Thu Jan 31, 2013 10:44 pm

mikeybound wrote:Believe me, I know. I just meant that if this really was a scam, I'd have found something. And I looked, too. I'm not discounting this until a reliable source says, in no uncertain terms, that it is fake.

In other words, I'm not a reliable source. Thanks a heap! :spank;
Anyway, go ahead and download their free book if you wish; likely no harm in that (assuming no computer viruses; which is unlikely here). But beware of anyway for which they might ask you for money for; that's all I'm saying.
Last edited by Jason Toddman on Thu Jan 31, 2013 10:46 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Dare to be different... and make a difference.
To boldly go where no one in their right mind has gone before...

Re: The Manhattan Beach Project. A Cure for Death by Aging?

Postby Zandor » Thu Jan 31, 2013 10:45 pm

I dunno if I agree wit feather of ya... the science could be real and the story's fake
You are q immortal

Re: The Manhattan Beach Project. A Cure for Death by Aging?

Postby Jason Toddman » Thu Jan 31, 2013 10:49 pm

Dann432432 wrote:I dunno if I agree wit feather of ya... the science could be real and the story's fake

Highly unlikely; either both are real or both are fake. IMO both are fake; health science hasn't progressed far enough for the kinds of things the ad implies.
Another generation or two, this may well change. But for now, I am highly dubious about such claims.
Dare to be different... and make a difference.
To boldly go where no one in their right mind has gone before...

Re: The Manhattan Beach Project. A Cure for Death by Aging?

Postby Zandor » Thu Jan 31, 2013 10:50 pm

I don't agree exactly. For I am a conspiracy freak. An.
You are q immortal

Re: The Manhattan Beach Project. A Cure for Death by Aging?

Postby mikeybound » Fri Feb 01, 2013 12:07 am

Jason Toddman wrote:
Dann432432 wrote:I dunno if I agree wit feather of ya... the science could be real and the story's fake

Highly unlikely; either both are real or both are fake. IMO both are fake; health science hasn't progressed far enough for the kinds of things the ad implies.
Another generation or two, this may well change. But for now, I am highly dubious about such claims.

You must be stuck in the 50's. Science moves faster then that!

Re: The Manhattan Beach Project. A Cure for Death by Aging?

Postby Jason Toddman » Fri Feb 01, 2013 7:54 am

mikeybound wrote:You must be stuck in the 50's. Science moves faster then that!

Depends on the science; not all fields progress at an equal pace. Health care has progressed faster than most; that's why life expectancy has jumped by about 20 years in the last century. But the kind of progress this ad implies is implausible - for NOW. I study science; I read various scientific journals. If there were ANY factual evidence to back up claims that the younger generation would see orders of magnitude greater life expectancy than mine did, I've have heard about it by now. We all would have; it'd be the biggest news since Apollo 11.
And I'm NOT saying such discoveries can't happen soon or won't happen soon; just that based on CURRENT knowledge such claims are science fiction instead of science. I can recall reading similar claims in science magazines when *I* was *your* age. They predicted life expectancy would be over 100 by now, 150 by 2020, and virtual immortality by 2030!!! I do NOT see that happening; at least not on such ridiculously short time scales. Eventually perhaps - but in the next decade or two... you're dreaming.
As for being stuck in the 1950s, much of our tech IS still 1950s. Cars look different but run exactly the same as in 1950; all that's changed is electronic software like GPS that has NOTHING to do with running the car itself. Rockets launched into space still use the same principles the first rockets launched by NASA did. We still haven't found anything faster than radio. The way we construct buildings hasn't changed in over a century. Yet science fiction and science journals from when i was younger predicted massive changes in ALL these by the first decade of the 21st century. Well, that's come and gone and we still don't have flying cars, personal jetpacks, cities on the moon, or robot maids, not are we likely to get them anytime soon.
If transportation tech had advanced as quickly as computer tech in my lifetime, Star Trek would be a reality by now. We'd have people in the Alpha Centauri star system, let alone on the moon.
If health care tech had advanced so quickly, we WOULD all be immortal by now.
But not all science and technology advances the same pace. All have definite limits - even computer tech - that we may NEVER surpass (barring discoveries that radically change the way we understand physics; something that hasn't happened since Einstein). Health care is one of them. progress is beign made for sure, but the quantum leaps we are discussing are NOT coming as soon as that ad implies. Eventually, yes. In our lifetimes (or at least yours), maybe. In the next decade or two (let alone now); forget it.
But you don't have to take my word for it; time will show which of us is right. And time alone.
Edit: Except for the racism of the times, i wish I really WAS stuck - literally - in the 1950s!!! I think I'd have been happier then than I am now in 2013. But then, I'm an aging fart yearning for simpler times again. :quirk:
Dare to be different... and make a difference.
To boldly go where no one in their right mind has gone before...

Re: The Manhattan Beach Project. A Cure for Death by Aging?

Postby mikeybound » Fri Feb 01, 2013 10:27 am

How sad that you think this Toddman. There's already plenty of Centenarians already. Sure, it isn't happening quite as fast as expected, but there's no reason to predict such a pessimistic timetable.
Also, as far as technology not changing much, take a look at this

http://www.ted.com/talks/anthony_atala_ ... idney.html
And this
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PMFrL7xt7kI
Also this
https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&source= ... 0P_UrQ6dhQ
Can't say you had that growing up. Can you?

Re: The Manhattan Beach Project. A Cure for Death by Aging?

Postby Jason Toddman » Fri Feb 01, 2013 10:34 am

I think you've missed my point completely, but screw it. I've had my say. Believe what you like; makes no difference to me.
Dare to be different... and make a difference.
To boldly go where no one in their right mind has gone before...

Re: The Manhattan Beach Project. A Cure for Death by Aging?

Postby Games_Bond » Sat Feb 09, 2013 3:36 am

Is there anyone else here that, like me, would enjoy discussing the philosophical complexities of what a human race without aging would bring, rather than get snagged on whether it is (yet) scientifically possible? The sheer possibility was bringing about some really interesting discussion at the beginning of this thread. I only glanced at the web page but my current understanding is that we will be able to stop aging one day, but not in my lifetime. And I can put my cynical hat on and say that only the rich will get it.

For me it is far more interesting to discuss how we would cope as a species if we didn't age. Initially, murder would be even more abhorrent than it is just now, because the victim wasn't actually going to die at some point in the far future, but then you'd have over-crowding of prisons with people serving "life" sentences. Then we'd have the problem of scant resources and going to war to thin out our population since it doesn't happen naturally. Or would we all pull together and build the technology to find and get to other planets to spread to?

Re: The Manhattan Beach Project. A Cure for Death by Aging?

Postby mikeybound » Sat Feb 09, 2013 10:03 pm

Games_Bond wrote:Is there anyone else here that, like me, would enjoy discussing the philosophical complexities of what a human race without aging would bring, rather than get snagged on whether it is (yet) scientifically possible? The sheer possibility was bringing about some really interesting discussion at the beginning of this thread. I only glanced at the web page but my current understanding is that we will be able to stop aging one day, but not in my lifetime. And I can put my cynical hat on and say that only the rich will get it.

For me it is far more interesting to discuss how we would cope as a species if we didn't age. Initially, murder would be even more abhorrent than it is just now, because the victim wasn't actually going to die at some point in the far future, but then you'd have over-crowding of prisons with people serving "life" sentences. Then we'd have the problem of scant resources and going to war to thin out our population since it doesn't happen naturally. Or would we all pull together and build the technology to find and get to other planets to spread to?

Perhaps once we beat the inevitability of death, we can all take a breath and slow down. Families of 3 and 4 can be built over hundreds of years, and as the population levels out we'd consume less as a species.
Another important thing is environmental stances. We'd probably work to keep our planet healthy. After all, what's the point of living forever if you can't take care of your home? People won't get to say 'it won't be a problem in my lifetime' because their lifetimes will last for millennia.
There is also life experience to consider. With death as an inevitability, we have only the stories of history to work with. Entire generations learning valuable lesson about life, only to be lost to death. Then the next generation must begin anew. Would it not be a better world if people who experienced centuries of its horrors and wonders, with the perspective this would bring, existed?
Well, that's what I think anyway.

Re: The Manhattan Beach Project. A Cure for Death by Aging?

Postby NemesisPrime » Sun Feb 10, 2013 3:05 am

Mikey, only the good things fade but it's the horrors that mankind's collective history will remember.

I would like to stay young for awhile but to die will be my final curtain call on the play called life. So act the part and have fun with it because you only get one chance.
Everyone speaks in multiple languages...But gag talk is universal and a sock in your mouth is the perfect translator!

Re: The Manhattan Beach Project. A Cure for Death by Aging?

Postby mikeybound » Sun Feb 10, 2013 11:03 am

NemesisPrime wrote:Mikey, only the good things fade but it's the horrors that mankind's collective history will remember.

I would like to stay young for awhile but to die will be my final curtain call on the play called life. So act the part and have fun with it because you only get one chance.

Well if you only get one chance, why let it end at 100 years? What if medicine could let it last 200, or 300? If the purpose of medicine is to keep us healthy, this seems like its natural conclusion.