## The Lunatics are Running the Asylum!

Post by drawscore » Mon Oct 12, 2015 8:09 pm

Being somewhat conservative, I think this is way over the top, but even many of my liberal friends seem to agree, that what is going on in California, carries stupidity to the max.
Last year California's Governor Moonbeam (Brown), signed into law, a bill authorizing the state to issue drivers licenses to illegal aliens.
Just last week, Brown signed another law, automatically registering to vote, anyone with a California drivers license.
That means that illegal aliens with California drivers licenses, are registered to vote in California.
I don't know about anyone else, but I sure as hell do not want the outcome of an election, be it for president, or for dogcatcher, hinging on, or decided by, the votes of illegal aliens.
I know we have some folks from Europe here, so let me ask how they would like it if the horde of Muslim "refugees" flooding into their countries, were granted the right to vote in their elections.
Drawscore

### Re: The Lunatics are Running the Asylum!

Post by EmperorDave » Tue Oct 13, 2015 12:51 pm

I am a bit confused why do you put refugees in quotations?

### Re: The Lunatics are Running the Asylum!

Post by wataru14 » Tue Oct 13, 2015 6:35 pm

So one side is trying to give the vote to people who shouldn't legally be able to and the other side is trying to take the ability to vote away from people who are legally able to. My head hurts.

### Re: The Lunatics are Running the Asylum!

Post by Jason Toddman » Tue Oct 13, 2015 8:25 pm

Up to a point I agree with you Drawscore as Maine recently tried to do something similar. But considering how difficult conservatives have made it for worthwhile people to move into this country in the first place while allowing lowlife trash like Somalians (who game the system far worse than any Hispanics ever did) come in unopposed, my sympathy to your cause is limited.
Dare to be different... and make a difference.
To boldly go where no one in their right mind has gone before...

### Re: The Lunatics are Running the Asylum!

Post by 31acujoker » Wed Oct 14, 2015 1:29 am

Gee I didn't know racism was a norm on this forum
"A thing is not beautiful because it lasts"
- The Vision

### Re: The Lunatics are Running the Asylum!

Post by Jason Toddman » Wed Oct 14, 2015 5:19 am

> 31acujoker wrote:Gee I didn't know racism was a norm on this forum

Who are you calling out? Me or Drawscore?
Normally I have no problem with race, and genuinely hate to sound racist. But do you have a Somalian community where you live? I do, and let me tell you these people are enough to make all but the most blindly liberal person in the world reconsider the entire matter of whether equality of races necessarily mean other races make good neighbors. The are cliquish to the point of snobbery, noisy, rude, and unpleasant in general. I have to move one time because they 'revitalized' the neighborhood I was living in by building cheap housing all over the block, and their moving in turned a once-quiet and peaceful neighborhood into sheer bedlam. Most of them were on welfare yet were living better than I was despite having a steady job at the time. WTF?
Dare to be different... and make a difference.
To boldly go where no one in their right mind has gone before...

### Re: The Lunatics are Running the Asylum!

Post by 31acujoker » Wed Oct 14, 2015 5:35 am

> Jason Toddman wrote:

> > 31acujoker wrote:Gee I didn't know racism was a norm on this forum

> Who are you calling out? Me or Drawscore?
> Normally I have no problem with race, and genuinely hate to sound racist. But do you have a Somalian community where you live? I do, and let me tell you these people are enough to make all but the most blindly liberal person in the world reconsider the entire matter of whether equality of races necessarily mean other races make good neighbors. The are cliquish to the point of snobbery, noisy, rude, and unpleasant in general. I have to move one time because they 'revitalized' the neighborhood I was living in by building cheap housing all over the block, and their moving in turned a once-quiet and peaceful neighborhood into sheer bedlam. Most of them were on welfare yet were living better than I was despite having a steady job at the time. WTF?

Both of you actually, I think you both forget you're still referring to human beings, and believe me if you travelled to live in their home countries you would find it just as difficult if not more so to adjust to the local way of life, I study sociology and the fact is, the Somalian behaviour that you find so appalling is just normal and socially acceptable in Somalia itself, which I'd like to remind you is basically a failed state plagued by famine, war and terrorism, where every person has to look out for themselves, they don't have the luxury of thinking about their neighbours in a polite way, since they'd be more worried about living through to the next day. As for how your government chooses to handle welfare and housing, well that's not really something I can help you with. Basically Jason I'd just like to remind you that you may think you're suffering at their expense, but the people you are chastising have very very likely suffered through far worse, just think about it
"A thing is not beautiful because it lasts"
- The Vision

### Re: The Lunatics are Running the Asylum!

Post by Jason Toddman » Wed Oct 14, 2015 6:59 am

Suffering at their expense? Are you sure that's what you meant to say?
Anyway, I know what you're trying to say, but I don't quite buy it. What you say sounds sensible (and I'd tend to fully agree if we were discussing virtually any other ethnic group). But as Maine is one of only a few states that they come to in any numbers (I have no idea why that is), I'll bet you haven't had to live among Somalians or ever even seen one. I have. Lots of them. And I don't like them. Literally no one here has anything nice to say about them; even the most liberal and likable people I know dislike them - most even more than I do. Nothing nice about them to say (excepting the youngest ones who were born here). It doesn't help that they seem to go out of their way to alienate everyone else here.
They may have suffered where they were, but if they want to be welcome here they should act like everyone else instead of demanding (and apparently getting) special treatment that even natural born citizens aren't getting. And if I moved to another country, I would at least try to learn the language (and indeed did when I went to Germany for a couple of years when I was in the Air Force). Even not understanding the local language, I would at least politely acknowledge someone when they said something to me (as long as it wasn't rude); not completely ignore them. The Somalians around here act like they own the place; not an attitude conducive to good feelings or respect for them or their culture. They're like the intrusive in-law who moves in and tries to take over the house.
If that appeals to you, you're welcome to it.
Dare to be different... and make a difference.
To boldly go where no one in their right mind has gone before...

### Re: The Lunatics are Running the Asylum!

Post by 31acujoker » Wed Oct 14, 2015 7:08 am

Fair enough, I can't change how you feel, I'd just hoped that maybe you'd be able to see things from a different perspective, but again, it's not for me to tell you how to feel. Just for the record, there may not be many Somalis in Australia but there are plenty of Sudanese, they get a bad rep with the general public simply because the media decides to cover a bunch of teens being dickheads. I know several Sudanese people and they're some of the most polite and respectful people I know...
But hey, at the end of the day, I shall respect your views and hope you can respect mine
"A thing is not beautiful because it lasts"
- The Vision

### Re: The Lunatics are Running the Asylum!

Post by NemesisPrime » Wed Oct 14, 2015 8:30 am

31acujoker, while I can't really comment on Jason I will say however that experience trumps perception.
Everyone speaks in multiple languages...But gag talk is universal and a sock in your mouth is the perfect translator!

### Re: The Lunatics are Running the Asylum!

Post by 31acujoker » Wed Oct 14, 2015 11:16 am

Yeah true mate
"A thing is not beautiful because it lasts"
- The Vision

### Re: The Lunatics are Running the Asylum!

Post by Jason Toddman » Wed Oct 14, 2015 11:20 am

> 31acujoker wrote:Fair enough, I can't change how you feel, I'd just hoped that maybe you'd be able to see things from a different perspective, but again, it's not for me to tell you how to feel. Just for the record, there may not be many Somalis in Australia but there are plenty of Sudanese, they get a bad rep with the general public simply because the media decides to cover a bunch of teens being dickheads. I know several Sudanese people and they're some of the most polite and respectful people I know...
> But hey, at the end of the day, I shall respect your views and hope you can respect mine

Actually, we have a Sudanese population here too. I have no problem with them. As you said, they are pleasant people. The Sudanese here are no exception. And they want to work for a living; not try to get free handouts. I've worked with a Sudanese man who was still struggling with English when i first met him; but at least he was trying so I cut him some slack when i didn't understand what he was saying.
But Sudanese and Somalians have little in common other than originally being from the same continent. You may as well compare French people with Spaniards; close geographically but not quite that close in culture (and a much different language).
And from what I gather the Sudanese here dislike the Somalians even more than the rest of us do!
And yes I do respect your beliefs.
Dare to be different... and make a difference.
To boldly go where no one in their right mind has gone before...

### Re: The Lunatics are Running the Asylum!

Post by 31acujoker » Wed Oct 14, 2015 11:35 am

Sigh.... mate that's great and all but you completely missed the point I was trying to get across (I was tired last night maybe that's why, idk) but what upset me was that you and Drawscore have gone and branded entire nationalities and ethnic groups with the same mark, not every Somali is a self-righteous bludger, and not every Muslim is a "fake refugee".
May I remind you we're on a forum where we could all be considered social outcasts by general society, just because we were born with a love of bondage. I don't know, I think on a board like this I just expected better than racism.
"A thing is not beautiful because it lasts"
- The Vision

### Re: The Lunatics are Running the Asylum!

Post by Jason Toddman » Wed Oct 14, 2015 12:34 pm

May I point out that I never mentioned Muslims at all? I in fact have no particular beef with Islam that i don't have with religion in general. Also, I only refer to personal experience with Somalians who have moved into the city live in myself and not Somalians as a whole. But as a group, the Somalians here are NOT nice people. Sorry if that is not politically correct, and I myself know full well how that sounds. Until I encountered Somalians myself, i too would have disagreed with such a statement. And I wouldn't have known what I was talking about.
It would be racism if I said they were inferior intellectually, culturally, or in any other way. I have not said this however. I have said they are unpleasant to be around; that is not only not racist but is a plain and simple fact. It's easy to cry racism when you don't have tpo deal with it yourself. If that runs counter to your worldview, then you try living in a neighborhood that has had a huge influx of them and see what you think then.
Dare to be different... and make a difference.
To boldly go where no one in their right mind has gone before...

### Re: The Lunatics are Running the Asylum!

Post by 31acujoker » Wed Oct 14, 2015 12:42 pm

I know you didn't mention Muslims, that's why I said you and Drawscore...
You said in your first post "lowlife Somalians" mate in case you forgot.
But whatever, I don't think I even care anymore
"A thing is not beautiful because it lasts"
- The Vision

### Re: The Lunatics are Running the Asylum!

Post by Jason Toddman » Wed Oct 14, 2015 12:50 pm

Just to further clarify matter however (and getting back more on topic), I pretty much disagree with conservatives in general when they talk about illegal immigrants. Most of those immigrants are from Mexico. Most of the places citing illegal immigrants used to be part of Mexico. We acquired these lands because we ourselves barged in and took them over; forcing Mexico into a war they could not win and then 'buying' the land for dirt cheap to make it seem legal but really essentially at the point of a gun. Hispanics get a raw deal in this country; many have been deported despite the fact that they were born in the USA as members of various indigenous Indian tribes.
Moreover, imo American Indians have gotten an even more raw deal from us whites than black people have. Black people can go back to their ancestral homelands if they wish (notice though few actually do so and no wonder!). Native Americans have nowhere but a few dinky reservations on land nobody else wanted. I have nothing but sympathy and well wishes for Hispanics and Native Americans trying to get by in this country; to them we're the frikking immigrants! And they're the ones we should be welcoming into this country; NOT the Somalians.
And yeah, i called them 'lowlifes'. Because a lot of them are. Maybe not all, but a lot of them. Maybe if you saw them yourself, you'd get it. But never mind; it's fine for you to be more liberal about it. I wish I still could be. I really do.
Dare to be different... and make a difference.
To boldly go where no one in their right mind has gone before...

### Re: The Lunatics are Running the Asylum!

Post by 31acujoker » Wed Oct 14, 2015 12:53 pm

No worries mate, it's not my country we're talking about so yeah I'll let you sort your own stuff out
It was a good debate though lol
"A thing is not beautiful because it lasts"
- The Vision

### Re: The Lunatics are Running the Asylum!

Post by misterg792000 » Wed Oct 14, 2015 7:17 pm

> EmperorDave wrote:I am a bit confused why do you put refugees in quotations?

Because he's suffering from the common delusion amongst right wingers that there's a secret worldwide Muslim conspiracy to invade the west and implement Sharia Law or, presumably, steal our white women.
As for the voting thing, it's a falsehood that has been bouncing around the echo chamber for awhile.
http://mediamatters.org/research/2015/0 ... orn/204852

> 31acujoker wrote:Gee I didn't know racism was a norm on this forum

Casual racism is to a drawscore thread what jelly is to peanut butter.

### Re: The Lunatics are Running the Asylum!

Post by Kyle » Wed Oct 14, 2015 7:29 pm

Why do so many people think the Hispanics have more of some kind of birthright to the land than other people with European descent? Were the Spanish just more righteous in their pillaging and destruction of Native Americans than the British and French?

### Re: The Lunatics are Running the Asylum!

Post by Jason Toddman » Wed Oct 14, 2015 9:37 pm

> Kyle wrote:Why do so many people think the Hispanics have more of some kind of birthright to the land than other people with European descent? Were the Spanish just more righteous in their pillaging and destruction of Native Americans than the British and French?

Nope; they were at least as bad. However, the nationality of their European ancestry is irrelevant. The Mexicans were down there long before the British and French. And considering the vast majority of Mexicans have Native American ancestry (the Spaniards interbred with the natives much more widely and freely than the French and English did), I still say Mexicans have the superior claim. Besides, they had established their country there first. Another thing is that, unlike in the areas taken over by the states, indigenous peoples weren't anywhere near as thoroughly wiped out south of the border - and of those that were, the blame can be laid on the door of the original Spanish settlers rather than their Hispanic descendants. Sure, there was some cultural clashes between them too, but Native Americans did better in Central and South America than they did up here in the US going into the 20th century. Hell, Canada also has a better record of treating its Native Americans than the US does. In that regard, the US has a cruel and violent history when it comes to the people we displaced. In some places like Texas, Indians were virtually exterminated without mercy!
Manifest destiny was seen as glory to the USA, but to people we displaced we were are are nothing more than invaders and murderers. It doesn't matter than it was centuries ago; the fact remains... and we accede to that bloody history by our continued actions against other peoples on either side of the border.
Dare to be different... and make a difference.
To boldly go where no one in their right mind has gone before...

### Re: The Lunatics are Running the Asylum!

Post by 31acujoker » Wed Oct 14, 2015 11:51 pm

> Jason Toddman wrote:

> > Kyle wrote:Why do so many people think the Hispanics have more of some kind of birthright to the land than other people with European descent? Were the Spanish just more righteous in their pillaging and destruction of Native Americans than the British and French?

> Nope; they were at least as bad. However, the nationality of their European ancestry is irrelevant. The Mexicans were down there long before the British and French. And considering the vast majority of Mexicans have Native American ancestry (the Spaniards interbred with the natives much more widely and freely than the French and English did), I still say Mexicans have the superior claim. Besides, they had established their country there first. Another thing is that, unlike in the areas taken over by the states, indigenous peoples weren't anywhere near as thoroughly wiped out south of the border - and of those that were, the blame can be laid on the door of the original Spanish settlers rather than their Hispanic descendants. Sure, there was some cultural clashes between them too, but Native Americans did better in Central and South America than they did up here in the US going into the 20th century. Hell, Canada also has a better record of treating its Native Americans than the US does. In that regard, the US has a cruel and violent history when it comes to the people we displaced. In some places like Texas, Indians were virtually exterminated without mercy!
> Manifest destiny was seen as glory to the USA, but to people we displaced we were are are nothing more than invaders and murderers. It doesn't matter than it was centuries ago; the fact remains... and we accede to that bloody history by our continued actions against other peoples on either side of the border.

Yeah unfortunately here in Australia our history is not much different at all when it comes to relations with the Aboriginal peoples, lots of injustice, murder, thievery and the like.
"A thing is not beautiful because it lasts"
- The Vision

### Re: The Lunatics are Running the Asylum!

Post by Chris12 » Thu Oct 15, 2015 1:03 am

> misterg792000 wrote:

> > EmperorDave wrote:I am a bit confused why do you put refugees in quotations?

> Because he's suffering from the common delusion amongst right wingers that there's a secret worldwide Muslim conspiracy to invade the west and implement Sharia Law or, presumably, steal our white women.

I'l slightly defend Drawscore here and point out there is a more rational reasons to put refugee's in quotations. Not every refugee is fleeing from war. A lot of them are fortune seekers from other countries who leap to the chance now Europe is flooded by refugee's they are unlikely to send back. Its not uncommon for those to be seen as leeching of ''true'' refugee's their suffering and that fortune seekers just aren't real refugee's. They do make the discussion less black and white, that's for sure. Those fleeing from war should be helped but is it unreasonable for a country to tell those only coming for a better job ''We are already in a crisis and you are making it much harder so we don't want to let you in''

### Re: The Lunatics are Running the Asylum!

Post by Jason Toddman » Thu Oct 15, 2015 5:54 am

> 31acujoker wrote: Yeah unfortunately here in Australia our history is not much different at all when it comes to relations with the Aboriginal peoples, lots of injustice, murder, thievery and the like.

Yes, and Tasmania apparently is like our Texas... but at least you folks in Australia stopped short of destroying Aboriginal culture, did you not? From what I have seen (I may be wrong), you seem to have accepted Aborigines into your culture and learned to respect theirs a lot better than we in the States here have with our own native population. At least the Australian aborigines are not confined to a few dinky reservations but have much more land to roam free in.
At least, that's the perception I get from the relatively little I've seen about Australian culture (like the Crocodile Dundee movies).
Dare to be different... and make a difference.
To boldly go where no one in their right mind has gone before...

### Re: The Lunatics are Running the Asylum!

Post by 31acujoker » Thu Oct 15, 2015 10:04 am

Yeah not far off, although aborigines are sadly still confined to their own communities and society in general tends to resent them as a bunch of drunk, petrol sniffing bludgers (ironic since we made them that way)
"A thing is not beautiful because it lasts"
- The Vision

### Re: The Lunatics are Running the Asylum!

Post by Jason Toddman » Thu Oct 15, 2015 11:28 am

Are they? I hadn't known that. That's so sad; especially since Australians seem like such a friendly laid back people otherwise. I've always wanted to go there ever since I saw some show called Skippy the bush Kangaroo when i was about twelve years old (almost fifty years ago now). I wanted to pet a kangaroo and play TuGs with the boy that was on that show (who remember was only a little younger than I was at the time).
Dare to be different... and make a difference.
To boldly go where no one in their right mind has gone before...

### Re: The Lunatics are Running the Asylum!

Post by 31acujoker » Thu Oct 15, 2015 12:37 pm

Yeah don't get me wrong though the number of people who care for aboriginal rights is starting to vastly exceed those who don't. And you should definitely come to Australia, you'll find we pretty much are the laid-back types you describe
"A thing is not beautiful because it lasts"
- The Vision

### Re: The Lunatics are Running the Asylum!

Post by Chris12 » Thu Oct 15, 2015 2:03 pm

> 31acujoker wrote:Yeah don't get me wrong though the number of people who care for aboriginal rights is starting to vastly exceed those who don't. And you should definitely come to Australia, you'll find we pretty much are the laid-back types you describe

Pretty much every Australian animal can kill(and will) though

### Re: The Lunatics are Running the Asylum!

Post by 31acujoker » Thu Oct 15, 2015 2:08 pm

> Chris12 wrote:

> > 31acujoker wrote:Yeah don't get me wrong though the number of people who care for aboriginal rights is starting to vastly exceed those who don't. And you should definitely come to Australia, you'll find we pretty much are the laid-back types you describe

> Pretty much every Australian animal can kill(and will) though

Nope, that's a myth, the majority of animals that can kill you won't attack you, and you'd have to go out in the outback to find them, there are a few notable exceptions like the Sydney Funnelweb spider which will follow you until it tires out or even dies, but of course you only find them in Sydney and surrounding areas. But most of our native wildlife just does its own thing, much like any other ecosystem on the planet.
So yes, there are a lot of dangerous animals, but very few will try to kill/eat you and there are just as many non-dangerous animals
"A thing is not beautiful because it lasts"
- The Vision

### Re: The Lunatics are Running the Asylum!

Post by drawscore » Thu Oct 15, 2015 5:50 pm

> EmperorDave wrote:I am a bit confused why do you put refugees in quotations?

My apologies for not getting back sooner. I am not at home, and the Wi-Fi connection in my hotel leaves much to be desired. I have since changed hotels, and the Wi-Fi here, is much better.
"Refugees" was in quotes because many of them are not refugees. They come in, and expect their new country to adapt to them, rather than them adapting to their new country.
Drawscore

### Re: The Lunatics are Running the Asylum!

Post by Jason Toddman » Thu Oct 15, 2015 6:30 pm

> drawscore wrote:

> > EmperorDave wrote:I am a bit confused why do you put refugees in quotations?

> My apologies for not getting back sooner. I am not at home, and the Wi-Fi connection in my hotel leaves much to be desired. I have since changed hotels, and the Wi-Fi here, is much better.
> "Refugees" was in quotes because many of them are not refugees. They come in, and expect their new country to adapt to them, rather than them adapting to their new country.
> Drawscore

Precisely the point of my tirade about Somalians... but in my personal experience at least that applies only Somalians (I've no personal experience to judge such things regarding any other groups). Thank you for the succinct way of putting it; I couldn't have put it better.
However, as stated, I don't feel that way with Hispanics; on the contrary, after stealing so much of Mexican territory nearly 200 years ago I think the people living in the southwestern United States owe them some consideration instead of the pseudo-Nazi tactics of people like Donald Trump and other high-level Republicans.
And don't even get me started on Native American rights; I myself tend to think of Columbus Day as Invaders' Day.
Dare to be different... and make a difference.
To boldly go where no one in their right mind has gone before...