On Religion

Postby bluemoon27 » Thu Jan 14, 2016 1:08 pm

This thread is for debating among religions, you could definitely join in at any time. Before hand you should state your religion then come in. I, for instance am an atheist. Now with that let the debates begin!

Re: On Religion

Postby xtc » Thu Jan 14, 2016 1:27 pm

Perhaps a clearer indication of the direction in which you would like this thread to go would be useful.

Polite request: please show respect for the opinions of others, even if they are barking mad somewhat different from your own.
Boxer shorts are cool,
but little speedos rule!

More by the same author: viewtopic.php?f=5&t=22729

Re: On Religion

Postby SolidSnickerdoodle » Thu Jan 14, 2016 2:23 pm

I'm worried that some people here might not take kindly to others' views, and this is particular thread going to turn into the spiral of unproductive arguments that we call the YouTube comments section.

That being said, I am profoundly interested in this sort of thing, so I'll join in.

I myself am agnostic. Basically, I don't think any religion has it right, but I also don't have the celestial confidence to make the definitive claim there is absolutely no higher power. There's so much about the universe that we don't know, and I'm not going to totally rule out the idea that something bigger might be at work.

Maybe as the thread progresses people can add new ideas and discuss further ideas. I think xtc is right. This thread needs a little more direction, or we're all going to be at each others throats.
There is only one God, and his name is Death. And there is only one thing we say to Death: Not today.

Re: On Religion

Postby Jason Toddman » Thu Jan 14, 2016 2:56 pm

SolidSnickerdoodle wrote:I'm worried that some people here might not take kindly to others' views, and this is particular thread going to turn into the spiral of unproductive arguments that we call the YouTube comments section.

That being said, I am profoundly interested in this sort of thing, so I'll join in.

I myself am agnostic. Basically, I don't think any religion has it right, but I also don't have the celestial confidence to make the definitive claim there is absolutely no higher power. There's so much about the universe that we don't know, and I'm not going to totally rule out the idea that something bigger might be at work.

Maybe as the thread progresses people can add new ideas and discuss further ideas. I think xtc is right. This thread needs a little more direction, or we're all going to be at each others throats.

Yeah, what you said basically matches my own belief. I think there may be a Higher Power, but I am extremely dubious that it is the god of the Bible or any other god any human has ever worshipped or heard of.
Basically, I think the actual truth is something that no one has ever imagined or guessed until at least very recent times.
I myself favor the idea of the Omniverse, where all universes/realities are not only possible but actually exist somewhere. Even those as outlandish as the Marvel Universe, DC Universe, Star Wars universe, Star Trek Universe, Harry Potter universe, and so on - each of those universes having physical laws different enough from ours to allow such beings to exist as we understand them (or indeed as any variation humanly imaginable; each in their own separate universes). On that premise, the 1990s TV show Sliders had the right basic idea but was otherwise very unimaginative.
I've also toyed with the idea - before it became more well-known and popular - of the Universe just being a lab experiment run by a not very bright science student, or perhaps a supermassive MMO we play to spend the time because our real lives (forgotten while we're in game as an imposed roleplay to add zest to the experience) live in a perfect - and perfectly dull - Eternity.
Dare to be different... and make a difference.
To boldly go where no one in their right mind has gone before...

Re: On Religion

Postby wataru14 » Thu Jan 14, 2016 8:10 pm

Oh dear. Have fun, everybody. I ain't gonna touch this one.

But just for the record: I'm an agnostic atheist/anti-theist.

Re: On Religion

Postby Driverman » Fri Jan 15, 2016 12:32 am

I don't have any belief system, but I fully support the rights of everyone to have their own beliefs and whatever helps them get through the day is fine by me. Way I see it, I'll find out when I die. Or not. But I am certainly not going to spend the few years I have of life worrying about it or trying to please something that may or may not exist. And don't mistake me for an atheist, I am open to the possibility there is something bigger, but my feeling is there is no way to know so I live my life as well as I can and make a point to never harm other people or do anything hateful. I have a clean conscience and a good heart, so if there is to be a judgement, I am confident I will pass. And if there is no judgement, then I am happy that I didn't spend my life trying to please something that is not even there. I don't need life to have some all powerful significance, I just need it to be pleasant and fun while I am here.

Re: On Religion

Postby viking » Fri Jan 15, 2016 6:35 am

agnostic would be the right way to describe myself.
i'm not denying the possibility of higher power, but i don't exactly worship some invisible man sitting in the clouds.
i also have to say straight out that i don't really care too much about what others believes or disbelieves. i have several friends who are christians, muslims, buddhists, hindu, and atheist. none of that matter to me, and the fact that i believe something different than them, doesn't bother them either, and that's the way i think it should be.

however, if there's anything that really goes on my nerves, it is those who judges anyone else just because of their religion.

not too long ago here in Norway, there was a muslim woman who entered a hair saloon, she was going to get some advice from the owner about the best may to color her hair, then the owner of the hair saloon noticed the woman wearing a burqa, and freaked out, started yelling at her to get the hell out of the place, she didn't want anyone who supports terrorism near her saloon.
the worst part about it was that the owner actually went out and bragged about it in the media afterwards.
of course, i agree that the crap ISIS is doing is barbaric and wrong in every possible way, but if i was going to judge every muslim in the world because of the shit ISIS does, that would be the same as if i decided to hate every musician in the world because of Justin Bieber.
no offense to the beliebers, that guy has pulled out a lot of crap lately, but that's for a different topic.

then again, it's not just muslims, christians has to deal with a lot of shit comments toward them as well because of what some christian people does.
the rage against homosexuals for an instance is nothing new.
the thing is, i know a lot of christian people who are completely fine about gay couples. i think i only have met one person in my whole life who is a christian and doesn't approve gay couples, but that is ONE GUY, not every christian person in the world.
again, i think those people who believes that being gay is a disease, must be the most stupid people on the planet, but i don't judge every christian person for being a stupid racist toward gay people just because of a minor percent of them is.

in conclusion, i don't have anything against a person because of their religion. i have a problem with the way certain people behave in the name of their religion.

if everyone could accept each other for who they are, and put religious lifestyle to the side, then the world might have been a better place to live.
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Once a scout, always a perverted pyromaniac with a fetish for knives and duct tape

Re: On Religion

Postby Jason Toddman » Fri Jan 15, 2016 7:27 am

Very well said, Viking. I agree with those sentiments wholeheartedly. cheers
The only thing I would add is that I also cannot stand those religious trolls who spew their hateful nonsense of science-related forums in places like Yahoo News or Youtube. They give all religious people a bad name, just as ISIS gives Muslims a bad name (if nowhere near as extremely).
Dare to be different... and make a difference.
To boldly go where no one in their right mind has gone before...

Re: On Religion

Postby crazyman4 » Fri Jan 15, 2016 10:16 am

SolidSnickerdoodle wrote:I'm worried that some people here might not take kindly to others' views, and this is particular thread going to turn into the spiral of unproductive arguments that we call the YouTube comments section.

That being said, I am profoundly interested in this sort of thing, so I'll join in.

I myself am agnostic. Basically, I don't think any religion has it right, but I also don't have the celestial confidence to make the definitive claim there is absolutely no higher power. There's so much about the universe that we don't know, and I'm not going to totally rule out the idea that something bigger might be at work.

Maybe as the thread progresses people can add new ideas and discuss further ideas. I think xtc is right. This thread needs a little more direction, or we're all going to be at each others throats.


I agree as well. Being someone who loves science, the spark of life is still not explainable. Follow the link if want to know more about the experiement on this matter. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Miller%E2%80%93Urey_experiment I also have a friend that is a Jehovah Witness(follow bible strictly) and I never like to deny others of their beliefs.

Re: On Religion

Postby NemesisPrime » Fri Jan 15, 2016 11:19 am

I'm agnostic personally. There may in fact be a higher power out there (I'm more inclined to think aliens) but I highly doubt it's Yaweeh, The Christian God, Allah, etc.

That having been said, it factors little in my experience, as long as people are not assholes to me based on my lack of non-faith, try to convert me, etc I'm pretty easy to get along with.
Everyone speaks in multiple languages...But gag talk is universal and a sock in your mouth is the perfect translator!

Re: On Religion

Postby SolidSnickerdoodle » Fri Jan 15, 2016 2:13 pm

Alright, let me ask you guys this, maybe get the ball rolling a little bit here. Do you believe that religion and science are separate? There's a number of ways to interpret this question, so I'll leave you to it.
There is only one God, and his name is Death. And there is only one thing we say to Death: Not today.

Re: On Religion

Postby .... » Fri Jan 15, 2016 3:40 pm

science dosen't blive in a magical fantastic wizard who created the univers... neither do i. as an Atheist its more than clear that Gods in genaral and Evolution are two major things that set appart. ask to your god what to do and its advice will allways come out of the mouth of a human or a machine. if i had a choice i would trust Deus ex machina rather than Deus. Alright now back to space!!

Re: On Religion

Postby Driverman » Fri Jan 15, 2016 4:11 pm

I would say yes. Religion is faith based, science is evidence and experimentally based. Sure science has hypotheses, but when someone says something is based on "scientific fact" that means it has been physically proven here on Earth. They can be intertwined, but religion, in my estimation, is a man-made thing to help explain certain things that science either hadn't at the time been able to explain or has yet to explain. Which again, like I said earlier, I am not ruling out a higher power being at work in all of this, but it takes human arrogance to claim they know exactly what that higher power is and how it rules and decides things, and what it's goals and purposes are. And that same arrogance claims this all seeing and all knowing power is watching every single little move each of us makes and judging us on each of them is a little hard to wrap my head around. But then, as the diehard religious will tell you, that is what faith is. I just don't see a whole lot that is scientific about it. But to each their own! I respect anyone the right to hold whatever beliefs make them comfortable and help them get through life as easily as possible.

Re: On Religion

Postby .... » Fri Jan 15, 2016 4:12 pm

and u ruined what i said... well done you have the better hand...

Re: On Religion

Postby Jason Toddman » Fri Jan 15, 2016 7:44 pm

Driverman said what I believe better than I could have myself. Science only covers what can be observed. By definition God cannot be observed; whether or not God exists, God is outside the purview of science.
Also too, most religion is by definition wrong since different religions teach widely different things as true... and they cannot all be true. As far as science is concerned, likely none of them are true. Science on the other hand gets a lot of things right and is self-correcting; improving all the time. Religion also matures and evolves (at least the Christian religions have) but so slowly now relative to science that it seems static. Anything based on faith and nothing more is, to a scientist, completely unreliable and without merit. By that definition alone, science and religion are separate. not necessarily incompatible; just separate... like apples and oranges.
Dare to be different... and make a difference.
To boldly go where no one in their right mind has gone before...

Re: On Religion

Postby SolidSnickerdoodle » Sat Jan 16, 2016 12:28 pm

Jason Toddman wrote:Driverman said what I believe better than I could have myself. Science only covers what can be observed. By definition God cannot be observed; whether or not God exists, God is outside the purview of science.
Also too, most religion is by definition wrong since different religions teach widely different things as true... and they cannot all be true. As far as science is concerned, likely none of them are true. Science on the other hand gets a lot of things right and is self-correcting; improving all the time. Religion also matures and evolves (at least the Christian religions have) but so slowly now relative to science that it seems static. Anything based on faith and nothing more is, to a scientist, completely unreliable and without merit. By that definition alone, science and religion are separate. not necessarily incompatible; just separate... like apples and oranges.

That's an interesting thought. For me, it's like there's some sort of paradox at work here. I believe that everything can ultimately be explained through science. But being agnostic, I won't rule out a higher power. But isn't the whole point of a higher power that it can't be explained by science? So does one completely contradict the other? Am I supposed to pick a side here? These are the kinds of questions that make people think I'm weird. :)
There is only one God, and his name is Death. And there is only one thing we say to Death: Not today.

Re: On Religion

Postby SolidSnickerdoodle » Sat Jan 16, 2016 12:56 pm

Another thing that I've been thinking about lately is the afterlife.

I personally don't believe that there is any afterlife. I don't believe that there is some fantastic/horrible place where our consciousness and soul manifest for eternity.

That didn't used to be the case though. For a long time I believed that there was a Heaven and a Hell. It's what my parents believed and it's what I was told by my Church, so I believed it.

Interestingly enough, it wasn't Hell that I was afraid of. It was both Heaven AND Hell. To this day, the concept of an eternal afterlife absolutely terrifies me. The idea of spending FOREVER in one place, no matter how supposedly great or terrible it may be, is one of the scariest things I can imagine. I always pictured the afterlife as one continuous, never ending day. There's so sleep, there's no end game, and there's no escape. Just 24/7 conscious existence.

These were the oh so deep thoughts that I had when I was little, and it often drove me to tears and kept me up at night. And for a lot of years, I honestly believed that it wasn't up to me. I believed that I was going to spend eternity awake in some place, wherever it may be, whether I liked it or not.

Maybe it's how I'm wired, but I'm the type of person who NEEDS closure in that regard. Life or at least my own consciousness HAS to end somewhere.

I once tried explaining this to my mom. In what was probably not the best choice of words, I told her, "I don't think I want to go to Heaven." She simply asked me, "where is your absolute favorite place?" Being about 9 years old, I told her Disney World. She then responded with, "It's better than Disney World."

Now, I love my mom, but I don't think she handled this situation as well as it could have been handled. Maybe it was my inability to express my thoughts logically, but I couldn't seem to explain to her that eternity is STILL eternity, and that I just couldn't deal with that.

This predisposition towards the afterlife seems to be embedded in my very being, and is probably one of the factors that drove me way from standard religion. We as humans have trouble grasping the concept of infinity. I guess I just took it a step further. Being agnostic, I think there may or may not be a god, but I just hope that if there is, then there's no eternal afterlife to go with it.
Last edited by SolidSnickerdoodle on Sat Jan 16, 2016 1:13 pm, edited 1 time in total.
There is only one God, and his name is Death. And there is only one thing we say to Death: Not today.

Re: On Religion

Postby 31acujoker » Sat Jan 16, 2016 1:07 pm

Personally I find it terrifying that once I'm dead, I'm just dead and nothing happens after that, THAT would be worse for me than spending eternity in one place. But then I'm also not a fan of the whole eternity thing lol.

My dad knows a guy who believes that when we die, our spirit or spectral form or whatever simply hangs around on earth and we can do whatever we like, though I can also find several things wrong with that, if you can't touch anything physical then that would be pretty lame, plus if that happened to every person in history who's ever died the place would be ridiculously overcrowded!

At the end of the day only the dead can tell us, and we can't exactly hear them :P
"A thing is not beautiful because it lasts"
- The Vision

Re: On Religion

Postby Jason Toddman » Sat Jan 16, 2016 1:15 pm

SolidSnickerdoodle wrote: That's an interesting thought. For me, it's like there's some sort of paradox at work here. I believe that everything can ultimately be explained through science. But being agnostic, I won't rule out a higher power. But isn't the whole point of a higher power that it can't be explained by science? So does one completely contradict the other? Am I supposed to pick a side here? These are the kinds of questions that make people think I'm weird. :)

I thought i answered this. They are separate but NOT (necessarily) mutually contradictory. Science can only cover what can be observed. God cannot be observed. He/She/It is therefore outside science whether or not He/She/It exists. Science cannot describe ALL truth; only what can be theorized and observed. For that reason, the idea of an Omniverse, though a very interesting concept and one I agree with myself, is outside the realm of science until such time as evidence for this concept exists. However, unlike God, testable evidence for the Omniverse may soon be found.
One consequence of such a concept is that if it is true, it implies reincarnation may actually occur - only instead of being reborn as another person in the same universe you'd be reborn as basically the same person (or at least a person with your identical genetic code); not once but an infinite number of times. Each time however would seem like the first and only time.

SolidSnickerdoodle wrote:Another thing that I've been thinking about lately is the afterlife. Being agnostic, I think there may or may not be a god, but I just hope that if there is, then there's no eternal afterlife to go with it.

There are many ways of thinking of this, and there's no way to know which is correct. It may turn out that the 'Afterlife' is the only real reality, and what we experience now merely a supper-massive multi-player online game we are playing to pass the time because 'Heaven' is eternal and downright boring. We are unaware of this because the game's program is such as to enforce roleplay to such an extent we forget our 'real' existence and think this is the only one. In this scenario when ti's game over and we return to our dull eternity we can just go on to playing another game.
Another way of looking at it is that each Afterlife is tailor-made to our wishes and desires. In you're into being tied up, then someone you really like will always be there to tie you up and do whatever else you like whenever you like as long as you like. You can experience anything you ever wanted... do anything you ever wanted. if you're the artistic type, perhaps you could create your own planet. Who knows? What i'm saying is, if there is a God who creates an Afterlife for us and has plans for us, that God is likely to make us endure an Eternity of Boredom. At worst, when we get bored, we might simply be reincarnated and all experiences would thus be fresh and new again.
Meanwhile, don't sweat over something you cannot do anything about. Just enjoy the life you have now. You never know; maybe it really is the only one you'll ever have; why waste it pondering the unknown except as a pleasant exercise in speculation?
Dare to be different... and make a difference.
To boldly go where no one in their right mind has gone before...

Re: On Religion

Postby Jason Toddman » Sat Jan 16, 2016 1:18 pm

31acujoker wrote:Personally I find it terrifying that once I'm dead, I'm just dead and nothing happens after that, THAT would be worse for me than spending eternity in one place. :P

Except that once you're dead you wouldn't know or care. Does it bother you that you missed the first 13.8 billion or so years of the Universe's existence?
Do you recall thinking before you were born, "Gee, I wish I was alive?' Well, after you die you're going to care just as much about things as you did before you were born... that is, not at all. At least you'll never be bored. Assuming of course that dead means oblivion.
Dare to be different... and make a difference.
To boldly go where no one in their right mind has gone before...

Re: On Religion

Postby SolidSnickerdoodle » Sat Jan 16, 2016 1:45 pm

31acujoker wrote:Personally I find it terrifying that once I'm dead, I'm just dead and nothing happens after that, THAT would be worse for me than spending eternity in one place. But then I'm also not a fan of the whole eternity thing lol.

My dad knows a guy who believes that when we die, our spirit or spectral form or whatever simply hangs around on earth and we can do whatever we like, though I can also find several things wrong with that, if you can't touch anything physical then that would be pretty lame, plus if that happened to every person in history who's ever died the place would be ridiculously overcrowded!

At the end of the day only the dead can tell us, and we can't exactly hear them :P

I'm glad you mentioned this. When I first began to drift away from religion, and my disbelief in the afterlife really began to solidify, I was left with what seemed to be the only alternative: oblivion.

Call me an unsatisfied brat, but the idea of nothingness after death didn't really sit well with me either. I was more than capable of understanding the concept, rationalizing that I don't remember life before I was born, so why would I remember life after I'm gone? It also seemed the most likely of the choices (ie eternity, reincarnation, etc). But still, the thought nothingness just didn't really appeal to me.

So, here I was in this sort of "cosmic limbo" with nothing to really look forward to. Since then I've developed my own sort of philosophy and thoughts about life, purpose, and what happens after you die.

During my freshman year of high school, I enrolled in an astronomy course. One thing I learned that has stuck with me ever since was a little principle called the conservation of matter. It basically states that there's always the same amount of total energy/matter in the universe, and that you cannot create more or destroy it to have less. It can only change form and be redistributed.

For example, when a person or animal dies, their body decomposes. And all the nutrients, atoms, and elements that make up their physical embodiment are redistributed back into the world. In other words, nothing is wasted.

So, in a nutshell, I believe that this thing we call life and consciousness is temporary; a manifestation of atoms and stardust coming together to a human being. Energy is borrowed from the universe and must eventually be given back, making death a natural cycle of the universe.

I'd argue that it's the most scientific approach, and oddly enough the most comforting for me. Because this way I'm doomed to eternal consciousness, but in a way I still get to be involved in the grand scheme of the universe. It's like a happy medium.

I'm not trying to make this all about me, even though that might look like the case. I'm just relating how I've come to deal with spirituality without religion.
There is only one God, and his name is Death. And there is only one thing we say to Death: Not today.

Re: On Religion

Postby Jason Toddman » Sat Jan 16, 2016 1:59 pm

SolidSnickerdoodle wrote:I'd argue that it's the most scientific approach, and oddly enough the most comforting for me. Because this way I'm doomed to eternal consciousness, but in a way I still get to be involved in the grand scheme of the universe.

You seem to be laboring under a misconception about the law of conservation of matter and energy. Energy can indeed not be created nor destroyed. It can however change form; and continually it does - into waste heat. There is therefore no guarantee that energy that makes up your consciousness retains that consciousness after Death; and in fact as far as science is concerned it probably does not. Just as an electrical discharge scatters into a shower of sparks which then disperse into heat, our consciousness may do the same. If it maintains any form of integrity we would call conscious thought, it would have to do so by some process we do not understand and which we have no evidence exists.
But of course you can take that thought only so far; after all we still don't know how consciousness... or indeed anything at all... exists in the first place. So just because we cannot explain it (yet) does not mean it does not happen. There must be an ultimate cause somewhere; whether it is itself a conscious being that knows (and cares) about us is of course still a matter of debate.
Which is of course why we are debating this now. :big:
At the end of the day though, I figured i'll wait until I know more about what the Afterlife is actually like before I get too concerned about it. I'll know all I want to know sooner or later; maybe sooner than i expect or would like given my age (I turn 60 this year).
Dare to be different... and make a difference.
To boldly go where no one in their right mind has gone before...

Re: On Religion

Postby SolidSnickerdoodle » Sat Jan 16, 2016 2:09 pm

Jason Toddman wrote:You seem to be laboring under a misconception about the law of conservation of matter and energy. Energy can indeed not be created nor destroyed. It can however change form; and continually it does - into waste heat. There is therefore no guarantee that energy that makes up your consciousness retains that consciousness after Death; and in fact as far as science is concerned it probably does not.

Yeah, I read back through my post, saw that, and then edited it. I forgot to include that it can also change form. Also, I'd agree that energy in the form of consciousness is not returned back into the universe in its current form, or is capable of living on by itself(sort of like a soul).

Wow. We're really going down the rabbit hole here. This isn't just deep. This is... #deep...
There is only one God, and his name is Death. And there is only one thing we say to Death: Not today.

Re: On Religion

Postby Driverman » Sat Jan 16, 2016 3:28 pm

Jason Toddman wrote:
31acujoker wrote:Personally I find it terrifying that once I'm dead, I'm just dead and nothing happens after that, THAT would be worse for me than spending eternity in one place. :P

Except that once you're dead you wouldn't know or care. Does it bother you that you missed the first 13.8 billion or so years of the Universe's existence?
Do you recall thinking before you were born, "Gee, I wish I was alive?' Well, after you die you're going to care just as much about things as you did before you were born... that is, not at all. At least you'll never be bored. Assuming of course that dead means oblivion.


I agree with Jason on this. I have absolutely no fear of death being the end. In fact, it motivates me to enjoy life more and be happy now because it's entirely possible this is it. So I don't worry about it and just live my life. It makes me a happy and balanced person to not have any of these sorts of things weighing me down.

Re: On Religion

Postby 31acujoker » Sat Jan 16, 2016 3:32 pm

It's not that so much it' just my brain can't really grasp the concept of nothingness, being in a state of nothingness, I just do like to think that something happens after we die. And yes I know "I'll be dead so I won't know" but it's just a thought that crosses my mind occasionally.
"A thing is not beautiful because it lasts"
- The Vision

Re: On Religion

Postby .... » Sat Jan 16, 2016 5:41 pm

shit... i prefer passing an enternity in my coffin than in hell...
oh Heaven is just a delight... do you have naughty stuff in Heaven or do they send special kinky demons to do it?... Somone write somthing about that i'm to lame to do it... it would be like:

-No plz! its a mistake i don't desirve hell!
- *Sight... and yet you didn't realise yet you are in Heaven! *takes ropes
-now guess where you will spend eternity...
X3

Re: On Religion

Postby drew2099 » Sat Jan 16, 2016 6:16 pm

I am a Christian and I really think that this chat is good for me.

Re: On Religion

Postby drew2099 » Sat Jan 16, 2016 6:30 pm

I believe there is a heaven, and it depends if you go to heaven or not If you believe Jesus is god's son and be saved by himare saved by Jesus Christ if you go or not. You go to hell if you don't be

Re: On Religion

Postby Jason Toddman » Sat Jan 16, 2016 7:07 pm

drew2099 wrote:I believe there is a heaven, and it depends if you go to heaven or not If you believe Jesus is god's son and be saved by himare saved by Jesus Christ if you go or not. You go to hell if you don't be

Pardon us if many of the rest of us prefer not to believe that. Personally, one reason i gave up in believing in the Christian version of God was because of the whole heaven and hell setup. Any God whose sole criteria for where we go in the Afterlife is based on what we believe rather than any moral choices we make (and, lets face it, regardless of what people once believed beliefs are NOT a moral choice) sounds neither all-good nor all-wise. In fact, i would consider such a deity to be bat-shit crazy. God is supposed to embrace ultimate justice, but what kind of justice is there in such a crazy notion as that? There are just so many things wrong with this scenario that it would take a book to describe them all; and in fact many books have been written on the subject.
I think though it would be best not to get into that here; depending on who joins in such a conversation could get ugly really fast.
Dare to be different... and make a difference.
To boldly go where no one in their right mind has gone before...

Re: On Religion

Postby Jason Toddman » Sat Jan 16, 2016 7:11 pm

ViXen MissElitAs wrote:shit... i prefer passing an enternity in my coffin than in hell...
oh Heaven is just a delight... do you have naughty stuff in Heaven or do they send special kinky demons to do it?... Somone write somthing about that i'm to lame to do it... it would be like:

-No plz! its a mistake i don't desirve hell!
- *Sight... and yet you didn't realise yet you are in Heaven! *takes ropes
-now guess where you will spend eternity...
X3

One person's heaven would be another person's hell. That's why i believe if there is such a place as Heaven it is custom made for each of us.
There is a story someone wrote matching what you wish for, only it's on another forum. I'll PM it to you if you'd like; if I can get the writer's permission to do so.
Dare to be different... and make a difference.
To boldly go where no one in their right mind has gone before...