Was this a leap of faith?

Postby vantran » Thu Aug 15, 2013 4:52 am

http://www.theguardian.com/world/2013/a ... e-kiribati

Re: Was this a leap of faith?

Postby Jason Toddman » Thu Aug 15, 2013 11:49 pm

More like a swim of faith. What a pack of idiots. And of all the places to want to go to, why there? Kiribati is one of the poorest and unhealthiest places to live on the entire planet, for Chrissake! Even an Mid-East Islamic country might have made more sense for these blokes!
Dare to be different... and make a difference.
To boldly go where no one in their right mind has gone before...

Re: Was this a leap of faith?

Postby vantran » Fri Aug 16, 2013 11:04 am

Jason Toddman wrote:More like a swim of faith. What a pack of idiots. And of all the places to want to go to, why there? Kiribati is one of the poorest and unhealthiest places to live on the entire planet, for Chrissake! Even an Mid-East Islamic country might have made more sense for these blokes!


the report said their aim was to get out of a country that uses their taxes for abortion not for cleanliness.

Re: Was this a leap of faith?

Postby Jason Toddman » Fri Aug 16, 2013 11:21 am

Naw... instead they want a country where the kids are complaining about the lack of sex ed., sexual health care and condoms.
http://www.abc.net.au/news/2013-08-16/k ... etworknews
and faces imminent flooding from climate change
http://search.yahoo.com/search?p=Kiriba ... 8&fr=moz35
and is already so overcrowded that there are some calls for widespread evacuation of the place!
http://www.theglobalmail.org/feature/ki ... under/590/
Oh yeah... what a brilliant choice of a place to take one's wife and kid! I can dig moving to Polynesia... but there?!
I think the point here is that a leap of faith without commonsense planning is a pretty GD dumb thing to do! Don't you?
Dare to be different... and make a difference.
To boldly go where no one in their right mind has gone before...

Re: Was this a leap of faith?

Postby Mister Mistoffelees » Fri Aug 16, 2013 12:00 pm

Ah yes, poor persecuted "Christians."

Not.

Seriously, their religious freedom is being impinged because they think that tax money is going to pay for abortions (apparently, these clowns haven't heard of the Hyde Amendment)? What a crock of utter bullshizzle! Do these morans(sic) know how much a house Christian in China--who literally faces jail time if they fail to dot every regulatory i and cross every t that Chinese law forces upon them--or a Coptic Christian in Egypt, currently having his church burned by Islamist fanatics, would simply love to live with the "persecution" they claim they can't stand? There are people of faith being jailed and killed for their beliefs, and these drooling cretins pitch a tantrum about tax money? They need to grow up, shut up, and by the way, pay back those evil tax dollars we spent helping rescue their sorry tochises...
Welcome to Snowden! Enter at your own risk...

Re: Was this a leap of faith?

Postby Kyle » Fri Aug 16, 2013 3:24 pm

I think I would take this as a sign from God they were in the right place to begin with.

Re: Was this a leap of faith?

Postby Jason Toddman » Fri Aug 16, 2013 8:48 pm

Kyle wrote:I think I would take this as a sign from God they were in the right place to begin with.

Dollars to donuts that this sensible idea never occurred to them and they'd disagree even if someone else pointed it out to them. people who do stupid s**t like this are usually not amenable to reasonable persuasion.
Dare to be different... and make a difference.
To boldly go where no one in their right mind has gone before...

Re: Was this a leap of faith?

Postby Kyle » Fri Aug 16, 2013 9:35 pm

Maybe they got the message this time.

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Postby GoneGoneGone » Sat Aug 17, 2013 1:19 pm

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Last edited by GoneGoneGone on Mon Dec 23, 2013 2:25 am, edited 1 time in total.

Re: Was this a leap of faith?

Postby Antonius97 » Sat Aug 17, 2013 8:27 pm

Ah yes, the *horrible* 'persecution' Christians face in this country.
-_-
I'm gonna be blunt, if you're stupid enough to think that this imaginary problem is bad enough to warrant you fleeing the country, humans as a species would probably benefit from your self-imposed removal from the gene pool.
I didn't choose the TUG life, the TUG life chose me.

Re: Was this a leap of faith?

Postby vantran » Tue Aug 20, 2013 9:05 am

Extremist view of Christianity: No abortions. No exceptions at all.

Re: Was this a leap of faith?

Postby Antonius97 » Tue Aug 20, 2013 1:28 pm

The fact that abortions are legal is not Christian persecution. Making it illegal on religious grounds would be an endorsement of religion by the government, and therefore unconstitutional. But they'd see it as persecution. I seriously don't get why so many high-moderate to extremist Christians feel that they get to bypass the Constitution...
I didn't choose the TUG life, the TUG life chose me.

Re: Was this a leap of faith?

Postby Jason Toddman » Tue Aug 20, 2013 1:56 pm

Antonius wrote:The fact that abortions are legal is not Christian persecution. Making it illegal on religious grounds would be an endorsement of religion by the government, and therefore unconstitutional. But they'd see it as persecution. I seriously don't get why so many high-moderate to extremist Christians feel that they get to bypass the Constitution...

It's not just them. It's virtually every religion you can name; Muslims, Jews, even Buddhists. People (not all, but some) from them all want special treatment.
Dare to be different... and make a difference.
To boldly go where no one in their right mind has gone before...

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Postby GoneGoneGone » Tue Aug 20, 2013 2:18 pm

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Last edited by GoneGoneGone on Mon Dec 23, 2013 2:26 am, edited 1 time in total.

Re: Was this a leap of faith?

Postby Jason Toddman » Tue Aug 20, 2013 3:04 pm

If anything should be required reading in this world, it should be this:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Demon-Haunted_World
which describes how superstition and ignorance in the modern technological world (especially in our political leaders) is downright dangerous.
Dare to be different... and make a difference.
To boldly go where no one in their right mind has gone before...

Re: Was this a leap of faith?

Postby truly_trussed » Tue Aug 20, 2013 4:08 pm

"When you believe in things you don't understand, then you suffer. Superstition ain't the way!" Stevie Wonder, 1972

Re: Was this a leap of faith?

Postby Antonius97 » Tue Aug 20, 2013 5:32 pm

Jason Toddman wrote:
Antonius wrote:The fact that abortions are legal is not Christian persecution. Making it illegal on religious grounds would be an endorsement of religion by the government, and therefore unconstitutional. But they'd see it as persecution. I seriously don't get why so many high-moderate to extremist Christians feel that they get to bypass the Constitution...

It's not just them. It's virtually every religion you can name; Muslims, Jews, even Buddhists. People (not all, but some) from them all want special treatment.

I was referring to the United States in particular, but yes, this is also a problem with religions elsewhere.
I didn't choose the TUG life, the TUG life chose me.

Re: Was this a leap of faith?

Postby Kyle » Tue Aug 20, 2013 6:55 pm

It's not really any different than the atheists who want religion essentially removed from public life at the expense of the freedom to express it. It's just more fashionable to jump on the "religious people" for it.

Re: Was this a leap of faith?

Postby Jason Toddman » Tue Aug 20, 2013 8:55 pm

Antonius wrote:I was referring to the United States in particular, but yes, this is also a problem with religions elsewhere.

So was I, but ditto.
Kyle wrote:It's not really any different than the atheists who want religion essentially removed from public life at the expense of the freedom to express it. It's just more fashionable to jump on the "religious people" for it.

Although I agree somewhat with atheists like Richard Dawkin that religions today are more a source of evil than good when extremists run things, I also agree with you that his style of militant atheism (as opposed to the more laid-back agnosticism of someone like Neil deGrasse Tyson, which i myself favor) is simply the opposite extreme - and i always distrust extremism in anything. Especially in religion and politics. Both of which are becoming dangerously polarized.
Dare to be different... and make a difference.
To boldly go where no one in their right mind has gone before...

Re: Was this a leap of faith?

Postby Antonius97 » Wed Aug 21, 2013 3:44 am

Kyle wrote:It's not really any different than the atheists who want religion essentially removed from public life at the expense of the freedom to express it. It's just more fashionable to jump on the "religious people" for it.

The people you're talking about don't want it removed from public life or inhibit anyone's freedom to practice it. We want endorsement of religion out of schools and government, mainly. I don't want to hear my principal lead the school in a group prayer during my graduation a few years from now. That doesn't mean I want praying in school outlawed, its completely fine with me on a personal basis, but a public school leading the student body in any religious practice is where I say "No, this is not ok."
I didn't choose the TUG life, the TUG life chose me.

Re: Was this a leap of faith?

Postby ProfessorRemnant » Wed Aug 21, 2013 5:52 am

This family was from my home state. The sudden delusion actually kinda makes sense in that regard...

Re: Was this a leap of faith?

Postby Jason Toddman » Wed Aug 21, 2013 6:44 am

ProfessorRemnant wrote:This family was from my home state. The sudden delusion actually kinda makes sense in that regard...

Why? What did you do to them? :mrgreen:
Dare to be different... and make a difference.
To boldly go where no one in their right mind has gone before...

Re: Was this a leap of faith?

Postby ProfessorRemnant » Wed Aug 21, 2013 9:23 am

Jason Toddman wrote:
ProfessorRemnant wrote:This family was from my home state. The sudden delusion actually kinda makes sense in that regard...

Why? What did you do to them? :mrgreen:


Oh, well, Jason, that's a long convoluted tale of alligators, fiber cord, a smoke grenade and a faulty gasmask...

Re: Was this a leap of faith?

Postby Diminished » Wed Aug 21, 2013 9:52 am

I wonder where they'll be going next. Hope they keep us updated :)

Re: Was this a leap of faith?

Postby Kyle » Wed Aug 21, 2013 2:30 pm

Antonius wrote:
Kyle wrote:It's not really any different than the atheists who want religion essentially removed from public life at the expense of the freedom to express it. It's just more fashionable to jump on the "religious people" for it.

The people you're talking about don't want it removed from public life or inhibit anyone's freedom to practice it. We want endorsement of religion out of schools and government, mainly. I don't want to hear my principal lead the school in a group prayer during my graduation a few years from now. That doesn't mean I want praying in school outlawed, its completely fine with me on a personal basis, but a public school leading the student body in any religious practice is where I say "No, this is not ok."


Exactly why did you assume I meant you, or people like you, in the first place? I didn't name anyone specific. That's kind of telling.

Re: Was this a leap of faith?

Postby El_Llama » Thu Aug 22, 2013 5:58 am

With regards to the first post: no, it wasn't a leap of faith; it was natural selection :3
As Abraham Lincoln once said: "People are often misquoted on the internet!"

Re: Was this a leap of faith?

Postby Jason Toddman » Thu Aug 22, 2013 6:36 am

Kyle wrote:
Antonius wrote:
Kyle wrote:It's not really any different than the atheists who want religion essentially removed from public life at the expense of the freedom to express it. It's just more fashionable to jump on the "religious people" for it.

The people you're talking about don't want it removed from public life or inhibit anyone's freedom to practice it. We want endorsement of religion out of schools and government, mainly. I don't want to hear my principal lead the school in a group prayer during my graduation a few years from now. That doesn't mean I want praying in school outlawed, its completely fine with me on a personal basis, but a public school leading the student body in any religious practice is where I say "No, this is not ok."


Exactly why did you assume I meant you, or people like you, in the first place? I didn't name anyone specific. That's kind of telling.

I don't understand your objection. You yourself brought up atheists. Antonius was simply (I assume) responding as one. What's the problem?
Dare to be different... and make a difference.
To boldly go where no one in their right mind has gone before...

Re: Was this a leap of faith?

Postby Antonius97 » Thu Aug 22, 2013 12:05 pm

Jason Toddman wrote:
Kyle wrote:
Antonius wrote:
Kyle wrote:It's not really any different than the atheists who want religion essentially removed from public life at the expense of the freedom to express it. It's just more fashionable to jump on the "religious people" for it.

The people you're talking about don't want it removed from public life or inhibit anyone's freedom to practice it. We want endorsement of religion out of schools and government, mainly. I don't want to hear my principal lead the school in a group prayer during my graduation a few years from now. That doesn't mean I want praying in school outlawed, its completely fine with me on a personal basis, but a public school leading the student body in any religious practice is where I say "No, this is not ok."


Exactly why did you assume I meant you, or people like you, in the first place? I didn't name anyone specific. That's kind of telling.

I don't understand your objection. You yourself brought up atheists. Antonius was simply (I assume) responding as one. What's the problem?

Well, I'm actually a deist, but in most discussions where religion comes up, its quite easy to mistake me as an atheist, since its so much more prevalent than deism, while most atheists and deists have near-identical views towards everything about religion, with the exception of the existence of a higher power of some sort or another.
Also, what Jason said. You did mention atheists in particular, Kyle.
I didn't choose the TUG life, the TUG life chose me.

Re: Was this a leap of faith?

Postby Jason Toddman » Thu Aug 22, 2013 12:14 pm

Antonius wrote:Well, I'm actually a deist

Oh. Cool. So am I, actually. I believe in a God as well; just not the arbitrary (in fact downright capricious), micro-managing, impossible-to-please, inexplicably for a creator clueless about human psychology, sociopathic, egomaniacal deity portrayed in the bible. I believe there is a deity who practices the Prime Directive (total non interference with His/Her/Its creation), and I hope also has created an Afterlife where the entry requirements are far less harsh and considerably more fair than the ones Fundamentalists believe in... and where's there's lots of interesting things to do too. After all, no atheist can explain why or how life or the Universe exist in the first place (they can explain the basic processes like the big Bang and the Laws of Physics or the Four Forces of Nature, sure; but just what caused them?), so why shouldn't there be an Afterlife as well?
Dare to be different... and make a difference.
To boldly go where no one in their right mind has gone before...

Re: Was this a leap of faith?

Postby Antonius97 » Thu Aug 22, 2013 12:41 pm

I'm more of the 'watchmaker' philosophy. I don't think this universe was created for humans, I just think we're an improbable by-product. And if whatever made the universe is/was intelligent enough to design all the laws of physics, etc, I doubt it cares much what us tiny little humans do.
I didn't choose the TUG life, the TUG life chose me.