00:01 hi y'all and welcome to tonight's live
00:04 stream we have waited seven years for
00:08 this moment in an act of Bravery that
00:11 not many adults could ever hope to
00:13 achieve 14-year-old Liberty German
00:16 filmed her own abduction hoping somebody
00:20 would catch this creep and within hours
00:23 she and her best friend Abigail Williams
00:26 aged 13 would be found brutally murdered
00:29 within the park where they had gone for
01:31 a walk in a secluded area in the park
01:34 now Richard Allen is accused of this
01:36 heinous crime he says he's not the guy
01:40 the access to this trial is incredibly
01:43 limited the only way to find out what is
01:46 happening in the courtroom is from
01:48 somebody who's actually physically
01:50 present sitting in the courtroom there
01:52 are no computers there are no cell
01:54 phones there's no tweeting so it's
01:57 old-fashioned pen and paper it's
01:59 oldfashioned notes pads and if you want
01:03 significant legal analysis of what's
01:05 going on your only choice is to turn to
01:08 YouTube and to people who are actually
01:10 present in the
01:11 courtroom the defendant has been barred
01:14 from presenting all of his most critical
01:17 evidence and we absolutely need boots on
01:20 the ground and eyes in this courtroom
01:23 and that's why I have traveled hundreds
01:25 of miles to be here present during the
01:28 trial now just hearing that a
02:31 13-year-old and a 14-year-old were
02:34 killed is enough to make anybody
02:36 incensed and then seeing the crime scene
02:39 photos would make anyone just absolutely
02:43 enraged they're just horrific but I will
02:47 tell you what we saw today outraged me
02:50 in a completely different way because it
02:52 was so brave and it was so courageous
02:55 and what we saw Liberty German do I mean
02:58 hats off she's worth a 100,000 of
02:02 whoever killed her easily so today what
02:06 I want to do is take you through the day
02:09 at trial give you some analysis as we go
02:12 and I'm going to then tell you now
02:13 naturally of course I can't show you the
02:16 video I'm going to show you the short
02:18 clip that law enforcement gave us before
02:21 trial I'm going to show you that and
02:23 then I'm going to show you and then I'm
02:25 going to describe to you the much longer
02:28 version that we saw today it was packed
03:30 with surprises things that were not
03:33 expected uh that just all the way around
03:36 not not at all what I thought we were
03:38 going to see but I think it had some
03:39 really important lessons and some really
03:41 important things that it will tell us
03:45 and through this we're going to talk
03:47 about law enforcement Witnesses who set
03:49 up the the introduction of this video
03:52 evidence and we're also going to talk
03:54 about some witnesses who were in the
03:57 part that day and boy I tell you what if
03:00 Richard Allen had not put himself at the
03:02 crime scene these State Witnesses sure
03:05 could not have done it that testim all
03:08 of that testimony was just a jumble a
03:10 real mess so special shout out to the
03:13 first five in the chat um El Jane and
03:16 Missy R Rita young Jeff nunnelly and
03:18 desert rose really great to see you
03:21 thank you for being here I also want to
03:23 give a special shout out to Sally and
03:25 Bill creel I really appreciate you're
03:28 watching uh I've been meeting a ton of
04:30 people just a few people I'm going to
04:32 shout out are um Lena and Mike Deborah
04:36 from D line and Gail who has been my
04:38 line buddy all right so let's get
04:40 started talking about what happened
04:43 today at TR and one thing I want you to
04:45 notice I had noticed these mysterious
04:48 things up on either side of the judge's
04:51 bench wrapped in kind of black plastic
04:55 trash bags but they're they're not that
04:57 big maybe that big something like that
04:00 but wrapped tightly in these black
04:03 plastic like a trash bag and I asked
04:06 somebody in the courtroom what what are
04:08 those guess what they are they are
04:11 cameras cameras that could be used to
04:14 film this trial but that are not being
04:16 used to film The Trial there are two in
04:18 the front and one in the rear of the
04:20 courtroom but they're not being used and
04:22 the trial is not being filmed not even
04:25 the audio is being released to the
04:27 public during the
04:28 trial so you know we've actually been
05:32 three days now into the trial and I
05:34 don't think there's been a single
05:35 mention of Richard Allen to this point
05:38 what the law enforcement is doing is
05:41 just setting up what happened to Libby
05:44 and to Abby that day in the park they've
05:46 taken us through the crime scene the
05:49 crime scene photographs and today we
05:51 went through a lot more evidence so we
05:53 started with uh Ryan o Oley who was back
05:57 on the stand and he identified a bunch
05:00 of items that were found in the creek
05:03 there were items of of clothing and so
05:06 forth that were at the scene but Libby
05:09 was not wearing any clothing and Abby
05:11 was wearing a mixture of her clothes and
05:14 Libby's clothes and then a bunch of
05:15 Libby's clothes were found down in the
05:18 creek so to kind of list those for you
05:20 Libby's Nike shoes uh blue jeans blue
05:24 jeans waist 26 the reason that's
05:27 important is that was probably aby's
05:29 that's why they mention the waist and
06:32 the clothes the jeans or pants that Abby
06:35 was wearing I think they were jeans were
06:37 probably libes they didn't fit her they
06:40 were the wrong size there was also a
06:42 tiedye shirt extra large a gray hooded
06:46 sweatshirt um underwear black and purple
06:49 sock pink sock head scarf and a black
06:52 Faded Glory shirt large all of that came
06:55 from the creek and then from the scene
06:59 because they cataloged all the physical
06:01 evidence that they collected there at
06:03 the scene Converse tennis shoe right and
06:06 left that were on Abigail Williams she
06:08 was actually wearing those Libby was
06:11 barefoot she was completely unplowed uh
06:14 a 40 caliber Smith and Wesson cartridge
06:17 that is ultimately important because law
06:20 enforcement says they can trace that
06:22 unspent cartridge back to a gun they
06:26 actually found in the home of Richard
06:30 Allen they say they can connect the two
07:33 uh and then stranded material there was
07:35 a good bit of it and we don't really
07:37 know exactly what that is or whether it
07:40 it we know there is a new hair that's
07:43 being analyzed that had not been
07:45 analyzed before although it seemed like
07:47 that might be something dramatic it also
07:50 now appears that it actually came from a
07:52 relative of Libby a female relative
07:55 perhaps her grandmother with whom she
07:57 lived or her sister who had just loaned
07:59 her her shirt for that day so at this
07:02 point there was also though we found out
07:04 stranded material from the right hand of
07:07 Abigail from the left arm of Abigail and
07:12 uh would that be no there's some more
07:14 we'll find some more through this I'll
07:15 keep reading there's going to be more
07:17 anyway they took um a bunch of swabs
07:21 from the inside of Libby's left wrist
07:23 and right wrist from her belly button or
07:26 belly I'm not sure which the thigh above
07:28 the knee uh here we go some more fibrous
08:31 material from the pinky finger of the
08:33 left hand of Libby now why are these
08:36 hairs and fibers so important because
08:39 one thing that law enforcement looks for
08:41 is if there's been a scene where
08:42 someone's been murdered there may have
08:44 been a scuffle there may have been some
08:46 kind of fight between the victim trying
08:49 to get away or trying to push the person
08:51 away and if so there may be hair there
08:53 may be DNA that would be underneath say
08:55 the fingernails by the way there were no
08:58 swabs taken under the fingernails and
08:00 there were no fingernail clippings that
08:03 were listed in the items that they
08:05 talked
08:05 about so they may have just missed that
08:08 opportunity um the okay they had swab of
08:12 the thigh I think I may have said that
08:14 sorry blood stain on a tree four feet
08:18 above ground level that's really
08:20 important in this case the defense says
08:24 there was a rune painted on a tree we'll
08:27 just briefly get into that there is a
09:30 significant wild and possibly
09:34 meritorious claim that the defense wants
09:37 to make but that the the judge has not
09:40 allowed them to make the defense says
09:42 that the things that happened here at
09:44 the scene were done by odinis as part of
09:47 a religious ritual that there were
09:49 sticks laid on the girls and I will say
09:51 it was bizarre looking and those sticks
09:54 were in a pattern that they say mimet
09:57 runes in addition they say that blood
09:60 from Libby had been painted on a tree in
09:03 the shape of something like a letter F
09:05 that is also a rune coming from a Norse
09:09 uh
09:09 religion as far as but all of that is
09:13 out what is in is that there was blood
09:16 on the tree there was reference to it as
09:18 the F tree or the F there was some other
09:22 word they Ed there that sounds strange
09:24 doesn't it the F tree but I think it was
09:26 something along those lines and the tree
09:29 according to the prosecution they're
10:31 going to argue that that blood on there
10:34 was something from hands that her hands
10:37 touched the tree the blood however we do
10:39 know is on the opposite side of the tree
10:41 so I guess she would have had to have
10:42 her arms around it Libby specifically
10:45 all right swabs from there were blood
10:48 stains around the girls in various
10:50 places and they swabbed those there was
10:53 a black Nike tennis shoe underneath
10:56 aby's body a mate to the one that was
10:59 found in the creek both of them belong
10:01 to Libby there was a swab from U all
10:05 kinds of swabs from the ground and also
10:08 for the between the tree not just not
10:11 just on the tree but like at the foot of
10:13 the tree a red stain below the head of
10:16 Abigail a swab uh from more swabs from
10:20 the tree from the left index finger and
10:22 left pink pinky finger of Libby and from
10:25 the cell phone of Libby underneath aby's
10:28 body were found not not just the shoe
11:30 but also the cell phone of Libby and so
11:33 they swabbed that as
11:36 well there was one of the things the
11:40 prosecution has done extremely well in
11:42 this case is respond the one of the
11:46 things that the jury asked and they're
11:48 allowed to ask questions here after a
11:50 witness finishes testifying and one of
11:53 the things they asked about suggested
11:54 maybe they were concerned about chain of
11:57 custody were they getting the real scoop
11:60 on is this real evidence and have you
11:02 preserved it are we seeing the final
11:04 real evidence so the prosecution has
11:06 expanded the amount to which they go
11:09 into detail and talk about exactly how
11:12 the evidence was collected and how it
11:14 was packaged and how it was preserved
11:17 and that's smart because that is
11:18 directly responding to what the jury has
11:21 been concerned about so that's one of
11:23 the things that they've been
11:25 doing there were um on he also went to
11:29 the tosy and collected items there as
12:32 well swabs from uh the left thigh and
12:36 right thigh and right breast and left
12:38 breast of Libby they did an um saay
12:41 evidence collection kit for both girls
12:44 what we understand the result is going
12:47 to be but we haven't had it testified to
12:49 is they were negative that there was no
12:51 sa against either Libby or Abby but that
12:54 evidence has not been presented at trial
12:56 that's just something we've heard about
12:58 and we'll have to wait and see whether
12:60 that actually materializes and it's true
12:02 at trial Trace fiber from the upper left
12:06 arm of
12:07 Abigail a black hooded sweatshirt on
12:11 Abigail from uh with the word German on
12:14 the back so that was again that was
12:17 Libby's clothing on Abby uh it said Deli
12:20 swimming of course she might have
12:21 borrowed that in
12:23 advance uh blue jeans size too big for
12:27 Abby with Derek on them
12:30 a gray cotton bra with red stains size
13:33 34 and that was a weird thing Abigail
13:36 was actually there were two bras on her
13:38 her bra and then Libby's bra put on top
13:40 of that which is I don't know I mean if
13:44 you can explain that to me please do
13:46 it's just bizarre just absolutely
13:49 bizarre but again it was very surprising
13:51 that they didn't swab under the
13:53 fingernails and that they didn't clip
13:55 the fingernails there was no mention of
13:56 that cuz that's such a common place that
13:59 long enforcement looks when there's been
13:01 an assault to see whether or not there's
13:03 something there that might be traced
13:06 back to the perpetrator DNA uh something
13:08 from Touch Hair skin cells anything that
13:12 they might could use to trace so they
13:15 were there one of the things that was um
13:18 a little frustrating about today is that
13:21 items were collected items were I am
13:26 very very tired I only got a couple
13:28 hours asleep I had to be there at 245 uh
14:31 so one of the issues is that the the
14:36 exhibits were often paper exhibits and
14:39 every single juror is getting a copy and
14:41 they have a folder that they're putting
14:43 all of these in and collecting them in
14:45 but and which is actually a great way to
14:48 have make sure that the jury has all the
14:50 evidence but in this particular case
14:53 what that means is people in the
14:55 audience can't see it so there's no real
14:58 way to see what the was a lot of times
14:00 they'll refer to photographs and then
14:02 they'll hand them to the jury but
14:04 there's no none of that actually
14:06 connects through and is shown to the
14:09 audience one they U went into the issue
14:13 of um the moisture on aby's clothing
14:18 that was one of the things they talked
14:19 about the jeans she had on were wet and
14:22 they talked about a line that was on the
14:24 sweatshirt she was wearing as well as
14:26 the pink tank top that she was wearing
14:29 underneath it both of them had a line
15:32 where there was water why is that
15:34 important it's because the prosecution
15:37 thinks that Libby and Abby were forced
15:40 across that they had crossed a an old
15:44 railroad railroad Trestle across a creek
15:48 long one very long it spanned a 60 foot
15:51 height and it went a long way into the
15:53 woods on either side that they were
15:55 forced to go down the hill on one end
15:58 from the far end from from where they
15:59 had started and that they were then
15:02 forced to go across that Creek it was as
15:07 the one of the officers said that it was
15:09 anywhere from one to two one to two
15:11 inches deep and up to three feet deep so
15:15 that line would be an indication that
15:18 maybe Abby really was forced across the
15:20 creek because she had waited in the
15:22 creek and that's why she was wet up to a
15:24 certain line so I think that's why
15:26 they're suggesting that there were there
15:29 were was also talk about the bullet the
16:32 unspent casing that was found there at
16:34 the crime scene and that it was a Smith
16:37 and Wesson it was a 40 caliber um what
16:41 it was a 40 caliber round and one of the
16:45 things they talked about was that one of
16:48 the most common weapons is a Smith and
16:50 Wesson now one problem today with some
16:52 of the law and frankly up until now too
16:56 some of the law enforcement Witnesses
16:57 are sort of hostile to the defense
16:60 and so they'll object to things that are
16:02 ah you probably shouldn't object to that
16:04 you know so and I don't mean they
16:06 literally say objection but for example
16:09 the witness was asked well one of the
16:10 most common weapons in the world is the
16:12 Smith and Wesson isn't it and I mean
16:15 that it's just true and the witness said
16:17 no like oh come on it is too you you
16:20 don't have to win every single point
16:22 that particular thing you could just say
16:24 sure and it doesn't mean you've lost
16:25 your
16:26 case the they talked about the fact that
16:29 the reason that they swabbed the risks
17:32 of Libby was to see whether there would
17:35 be some DNA there from the perpetrator
17:37 somewhere that wasn't maybe her blood
17:39 but maybe where some blood of the
17:42 perpetrator might be mixed in maybe
17:44 they'd be able to collect something but
17:47 as the defense pointed out there was no
17:49 connection to Richard Allen now at this
17:51 point there was an objection sustain
17:54 where the prosecution said look this is
17:56 not really the witness to ask if that
17:59 this stuff was DNA connected to Richard
17:02 Allen you need to ask the DNA witness
17:04 and the judge said sustained ask another
17:07 witness all right I have tons and tons
17:10 of people to thank and I'm so excited
17:12 thank you uh Lisa Williams curious EES
17:16 uh Carol Carolina RN Bethany are all new
17:20 members thank you so much I'm excited to
17:23 have you along Nemesis I appreciate that
17:26 very much and Michael Lon has been a
17:29 member for six months fantastic thank
18:31 you Michael and I'm so glad you're back
18:33 he was displaced by the
18:35 Hurricanes Joe barard thank you very
18:39 much I appreciate the super sticker and
18:40 Marissa Fontaine and a and I will get to
18:44 the others in just a minute let's go
18:46 back to our our talk of the day
18:51 so the let's see we'll head on to um the
18:56 there was talk when in this particular
18:58 witness and did I even tell you who the
18:00 witness was now that now that we're far
18:02 into what the Bri yes I did Brian Oley
18:06 okay so I did I did mention who the
18:08 witness was one of the things was that
18:10 one of the things he was asked was about
18:12 a breach of Integrity of photos from the
18:15 investigation he just said I don't have
18:17 any knowledge of that and I talked
18:20 yesterday they had sort of hinted at
18:22 that from the defense wanting to say hey
18:24 y'all Le some photographs but they they
18:28 are a little a little at risk there
18:30 since there was also an issue related to
19:32 the defense having photographs on a
19:35 table and those getting leaked by
19:36 someone who knew the defense side and
19:38 the judge felt like it was something
19:41 that was directly attributable and that
19:42 the defense lawyers ought to be punished
19:45 for now they were reinstated by the
19:47 Supreme Court they remain Richard
19:49 Allen's attorneys but still it's a
19:51 little Brave to talk about that they got
19:53 nowhere with it since he said he had no
19:55 knowledge of
19:56 it he thought um and this is certainly
19:59 what I thought initially when there were
19:02 sticks on top of Abby and Libby and he
19:06 said he thought they were an attempt at
19:08 concealment having seen them I don't buy
19:11 that I don't buy that at all I mean I
19:13 pictured branches from trees with you
19:16 know leaves or ferns maybe something
19:19 that was big leafy green that would
19:21 maybe cover up the girls they were not
19:23 like this these were sticks just sticks
19:27 that were placed on the girls it would
19:29 would do anything to conceal them
20:31 because there were just I think two
20:32 sticks on Libby three on Abby so it it
20:35 really wouldn't make any sense to put
20:38 sticks on them to conceal them so
20:40 personally that's just my take since we
20:44 I can't show you the pictures I'm going
20:45 to try to give you my very best
20:47 description of what I think about
20:49 it he said he did not see any cut sticks
20:54 or anything like that one thing I wanted
20:57 to note he he talked about a he did
20:00 about not seeing any significance in the
20:02 way the sticks were positioned as you
20:05 know the defense claims that these were
20:08 in the shape of runes that the the way
20:11 they were placed had meaning the way
20:13 they were on top of each other had
20:15 meaning but in this particular case he
20:18 said he didn't see any significance to
20:20 that one of the effects of that is the
20:23 prosecution is Hemming itself in when it
20:25 comes to the possible prosecution of
20:27 anybody else so each time they eliminate
21:30 one of Richard Allen's arguments that
21:33 someone else could have been involved or
21:35 they address that and push that aside
21:37 that then pin that witness down to that
21:39 particular statement of fact and then
21:42 they're stuck that's what they have to
21:44 testify to from here on out or the
21:46 lawyer will say well didn't you say back
21:48 then that you thought that these sticks
21:50 had absolutely no meaning that there was
21:53 no significance no communication it
21:55 wasn't a rune didn't you say that he
21:57 didn't use the word romee but that's
21:59 exactly how the cross would
21:01 go so let's see um the sweatshirt on
21:06 Abby was too large for her the jeans on
21:08 her uh were too large for her the sizing
21:11 was more consistent with the size of
21:14 Libby and that ger and what the witness
21:18 said was it looked like Libby had
21:21 disrobed and then her clothes got put on
21:24 Abigail not 100% correlation because
21:28 Abigail's clothes
21:29 were at least her jeans were in the
22:32 creek so it just was a bizarre situation
22:35 he was not able to determine he said the
22:38 location where that exchange of clothing
22:41 occurred he couldn't figure it out
22:43 either he mentioned one large stick had
22:46 an indentation and he thought that it
22:48 had been moved from near the body I
22:53 could if do you have any idea what that
22:54 means if you do put that in the chat I
22:57 wrote it down and just scratched head
22:59 over it I have no idea what he meant by
22:01 that there was foot traffic in the area
22:04 before Oley got there for his search and
22:07 he never really worked or did anything
22:10 with the shoe Impressions that would
22:12 have been available right there at the
22:14 scene the defense obviously wants a
22:16 point of that to say that this was a a
22:19 shoddy incomplete investigation that
22:21 they fingered Richard Allen without
22:23 really bothering to see whether other
22:26 people might have been involved might
22:27 have been more responsible
22:29 there was no attempt to look for
23:31 fingerprints at the scene they F tree
23:34 they did call it an F tree see I was
23:36 right about that it had red staining and
23:38 a blood spatter expert was finally hired
23:41 by the state this year to look at the
23:44 tree the defense ask the witness well
23:47 why not hire someone earlier why wait so
23:49 long to hire a blood spatter expert and
23:53 he said well we had a guy who knew
23:55 enough about it and there this was again
23:57 an example the witness really arguing
23:60 which I think can make it more difficult
23:02 for the jury because to believe the
23:04 person because if they argue too much
23:06 it's a lot of times better if a witness
23:08 just acknowledges a few things where hey
23:11 life isn't perfect I yes I probably
23:13 should have done that
23:15 earlier all right I already talked about
23:17 the water level he was not able to
23:19 locate a point where one or more
23:22 individuals climbed up that Northshore
23:24 so to set the scene and I I've got
23:29 a slide here that I can show you let's
24:31 pull one up so we can kind of get a look
24:33 at what we're talking about okay so um
24:38 you see where the bodies were and I said
24:40 last night I was going to move this
24:41 further down but I hadn't done it yet
24:43 you if you see kind of go toward the
24:45 middle of that the blue I did where the
24:48 creek is so you could see more easily
24:50 where Deer Creek is located the clothing
24:54 was in the water but on one side the
24:59 south side of the creek the bodies were
24:01 on the north side of the
24:04 creek and the creek by the way just FYI
24:07 flows from right to left from where you
24:11 see Logan home over there toward Freedom
24:14 Bridge that's the direction of the flow
24:16 of the creek so the bodies and the
24:18 clothing were on opposite sides although
24:21 the clothing was in the creek so it
24:23 wasn't it wasn't like it was on the
24:26 shore and so one of the things
24:29 the the girls were forced down the Monon
25:32 High Bridge which you can see in small
25:35 print there oh I no I put it in in red
25:38 too monan high bridge and there's an
25:40 arrow to it it's a long bridge so it
25:43 spans that Creek plus a good bit on
25:46 either side the girls were forced down
25:48 the hill law enforcement believes on the
25:51 south side which would kind of make
25:53 sense for where their clothing was found
25:55 in the creek on the west side but then
25:58 their bodies were found on the North
25:60 side so the question is you know how did
25:02 that happen and where did this exchange
25:05 of clothing happen how where and how did
25:07 all of this happen right in the middle
25:08 of a par where of course there aren't
25:10 that many people around but there are
25:12 other people around and the defense has
25:14 done a good job of getting people to
25:16 talk about how sound carries in there
25:18 and people probably would have heard the
25:20 girls had they screamed so how did this
25:22 happen how exactly did the clothing get
25:24 in the creek and the bodies up on the
25:26 hill and one of the things that the
25:29 defense said well did you locate a spot
26:31 where the girls came on the South Side
26:34 who knows how the clothing happened they
26:36 moved to the north side and then they
26:38 had to go up to the spot where the
26:40 bodies were found and they did you find
26:43 a spot where one or more individuals
26:45 climbed up that Northshore and the
26:47 witness had to say no he didn't find
26:49 that so I think the defense is going to
26:51 argue that the girls were taken out by
26:55 Road in a car from underneath the bridge
26:58 because a road does run under the bridge
26:00 right where they were forced down and I
26:02 think the witness will say they were
26:04 taken somewhere not the witness the
26:06 defense and they were brought back to
26:08 the morning height Cemetery you see up
26:10 there and then probably maybe dead
26:14 already I'm not really sure what the
26:15 argument will be and then they made
26:18 their way down that hill to where the
26:20 bodies are which by the way is extremely
26:22 steep from what we've heard everything
26:24 on that side between morning height
26:26 cemetery and the creek there's a there
26:29 are a lot of very steep areas in
27:32 there one of the most uh most difficult
27:36 things for the defense is the fact that
27:38 that unspent casing was found at the
27:40 scene and matched to Richard Allen's Gun
27:44 now Richard Allen has a number of
27:45 arguments against it one he wants to
27:47 make is that this whole concept that you
27:49 can match an unspent casing to a
27:52 particular gun is just nonsense now that
27:55 witness may or may not be allowed to
27:57 testify judge G has under advisement and
27:59 I don't think she's ruled yet now one of
27:02 the things he he also argues is that
27:05 there isn't really a match they've made
27:07 this up and then a third thing he wants
27:09 to argue is maybe any match was invented
27:12 by you law enforcement and he wants to
27:16 do that by suggesting that there aren't
27:19 enough photographs to show that bullet
27:21 that there are some photographs showing
27:22 it in the ground there are none showing
27:25 it taken out of the ground none showing
27:27 it in the lab just
27:29 results of testing they may actually
28:32 have made a little Headway on that today
28:34 maybe some unexpected Headway from a
28:37 juror
28:38 question I think and I think so did a
28:41 juror that the witness who collected the
28:44 bullet said that they were placed into
28:46 some kind of uh ten or box and the
28:50 witness today testified that the bullets
28:53 were in paper they they were inside some
28:56 paper so one of the arents his team may
28:59 have is that there was a collection of
28:02 this bullet and somehow a different
28:03 bullet was put in there one was in a box
28:06 one was in paper it couldn't have been
28:08 the same that may be an argument that
28:09 his team will have now we're I would
28:12 have to go back to my notes and make
28:13 sure but from a juror question I think
28:15 they remembered the same thing I
28:18 did all right let's keep going and I
28:21 have let me make sure that I am keeping
28:23 up I'm very grateful for your super
28:26 stickers I think you don't even
28:28 understand how encouraging it is that
28:29 y'all do that it just makes me think oh
29:31 good they're really enjoying this so
29:33 this is something they actually want and
29:35 enjoy so thank you Aon M spunky thank
29:38 you for the super sticker and Martha
29:41 Chandler thank you so much ARA Sheridan
29:45 appreciate it and
29:47 Kathy thank you Kathy and Joby ream so
29:52 appreciative and look at that neuros
29:53 site Zena has been a member for four
29:55 months that's great I'm so glad to have
29:58 you as a member for that
29:59 long Barbie's two bits is saying
29:02 grateful for the hardships you endure
29:04 this has been B just unexpectedly
29:08 difficult to bring this uh information
29:10 to you I do think it's important but uh
29:13 we also are probably going to end up
29:14 talking at the end about just some of
29:16 the things that make it difficult to
29:18 report on this and some ways that I
29:20 think I'm might might have to adjust
29:22 just to make it physically possible to
29:24 do all right the there was a
29:29 situation as the defense pointed out
30:31 where a sock was collected at the scene
30:34 and there's a picture of someone holding
30:36 the sock with their bare hand obviously
30:39 not the greatest crime
30:42 scene uh identification and collection
30:46 technique right because the DNA of the
30:49 person picking it up might end up on the
30:51 sock and and confuse some issues so that
30:54 was one thing the defense pointed out
30:56 and that there were no defensive wounds
30:58 anywhere on Libby's body and there was a
30:03 just there were some questions from the
30:05 defense earlier about the bodies and
30:08 whether or not law enforcement had
30:10 looked at bug activity or feral animal
30:12 activity the defense would like to say
30:15 there was no reason there is no reason
30:18 for the prosecution to believe that
30:20 these bodies were at the scene for a
30:24 full day because there was nothing that
30:28 had been happen to the bodies that you
30:29 might expect to happen over the course
31:31 of a full day if they've been killed in
31:34 the afternoon on the 13th and found on
31:37 the 14th maybe there would have been
31:39 more problems with the body like bugs or
31:43 like feral animals but in this
31:45 particular case it was Winter it was
31:47 February so I don't think that argument
31:50 has kind of gone anywhere because I
31:52 think it I think most people think yeah
31:54 you don't really have bugs and the
31:56 witness did say that animal AC it is
31:58 attracted by bug activity which I
31:01 thought was I'd never heard of that I I
31:03 certainly think that feral animals would
31:05 be attractive regardless of bug activity
31:08 if they're hungry but in this particular
31:10 case I didn't think it was a super
31:12 strong argument and there were a ton of
31:15 Juror questions jurors are allowed to
31:18 ask questions in this case and these
31:20 jurors have been very active and they've
31:22 been very proactive with making
31:25 questions that are fact-based and
31:27 they're getting important questions in
31:29 and getting good answers the first was
32:32 did the undergrowth appear to be
32:34 disrupted under Abby to indicate she was
32:36 dressed as she lay there you what a
32:38 great practical question yes that that's
32:40 a good one he said he didn't recall
32:43 that the next question when evidence was
32:45 tested at the lab how is that logged and
32:48 resealed in the same bag and they went
32:50 into detail as I mentioned earlier to
32:52 make sure that the jury understood how
32:55 exactly evidence is collected Catal LA
32:58 and
32:60 preserved next question is it common
32:02 practice to change gloves during
32:04 evidence collection or for that matter
32:06 wear them and the witness said yes and
32:10 was the bullet collected in the envelope
32:12 or a pill pill box and he said an
32:15 envelope and it was never
32:17 removed very fascinating because that I
32:21 remember like the juror that I think
32:23 they said a pill box but I I have to go
32:26 back to my now many notebooks ago juror
32:30 question final one what ident with this
33:32 witness what identifies which I items
33:35 were reopened by a lab and he explained
33:37 it so you can see they have a lot of
33:38 questions around what is what is the
33:41 preservation of evidence what have you
33:43 done to make sure we're only getting
33:44 real good solid evidence that is clean
33:48 that's connected to this particular
33:50 crime scene so we know we're not getting
33:52 the wool pull pulled over our eyes the
33:54 net witness uh Trooper Brian bunner ISP
33:57 for 20 years Indiana State Police he
33:00 oversees the digital forensit program he
33:03 used celebrite to extract data from
33:06 Libby's phone and he got a video and now
33:09 I am going to describe to you what we
33:11 saw in this video up until now in fact
33:14 I'm going to start with let me show you
33:16 what law enforcement had released they
33:18 had released a 4 second clip of a well
33:23 first they started with even less than
33:25 that they started with a clip of a man I
33:27 won't tell you what it says just in case
33:29 you haven't heard I won't predispose you
34:31 one way or the other but there was this
34:33 brief clip and that gets played and then
34:37 um they later they added a little bit
34:40 more to it so that there's a little bit
34:43 more I'm going to play both or just a
34:44 few seconds so let's add that to
34:48 the I'm playing it over and
34:56 overing so that's a still shot from from
34:02 Libby's video and there's a little bit
34:04 of the clip of video first they release
34:06 the
34:11 audio oh that's not very
34:15 loud and I can tell you why in just a
34:18 minute okay so what we heard was the
34:22 whole video and I'm going to tell you it
34:24 was both more important and less
34:28 impactful to the case at the same time
35:31 than I had expected and I'll just kind
35:34 of describe to you what I saw and then
35:36 give you some analysis because we have
35:37 been waiting for this video for seven
35:39 years Libby German one of the most
35:43 courageous people you could ever meet
35:45 filmed this from her own from her own
35:49 phone from her own camera she filmed
35:51 this as she was being abducted as the
35:54 the person was coming toward her and she
35:56 got just a little bit
35:58 the what the law enforcement had
35:60 released was that picture of a man and a
35:02 little bit of him walking then a little
35:04 bit of video and the the reason the
35:07 audio was so hard to hear and so light
35:10 on that second one is that's when they
35:12 first released it but it had not yet
35:13 been enhanced and I will tell you what
35:16 it was really difficult to hear what
35:19 here's what it looked like to me it
35:21 looked like somebody is trying to film
35:23 without letting the per the people know
35:27 that they're trying to film so it's a
35:30 lot of this you know movement around
36:32 there's it flips up and you can see the
36:34 bridge really quickly I could not even
36:37 catch fast enough and I was you know off
36:39 to the side so that could have affected
36:41 it but I couldn't even catch that there
36:44 was a picture of a man there and there's
36:48 apparently Abby and then a man up behind
36:51 comes up behind her and Abby comes
36:54 toward Libby now at that point I don't
36:57 know their voice voices but there's a
36:00 high pitched sort of nervous sounding
36:03 girlish voice and the one thing that you
36:06 could hear clearly on it was some
36:10 whimpering from a girl and then there's
36:13 no path there for me to go to so that's
36:16 where they say law enforcement I would
36:19 believe anyway that the girls were being
36:21 ordered down the hill and when you heard
36:23 that first clip with the audio with the
36:26 enhanced audio it says down the hill
36:29 later law enforcement released yet
37:30 another piece that seems to say guys
37:34 down the hill but it is it needs it's
37:37 the kind of thing that you need to play
37:39 over and over in Loop and play in slow
37:41 motion they've played it twice now at
37:44 trial but you can't just play evidence
37:47 you can't just put evidence out over and
37:49 over again at trial because that becomes
37:52 too much of an emphasis on it and the
37:53 jury should just accept it for what it
37:55 is but I should think if they're given
37:57 any kind of video equipment back in the
37:59 Jury Room that they would play that over
37:02 and over and over again as soon as it's
37:04 released I know that's what I want to do
37:05 because I want to hear what is
37:07 said there was the what it looked to me
37:11 like was that Libby was saw what was
37:16 happening and she thought I better film
37:18 this and she started filming you have a
37:20 lot of it's up then it's the ground and
37:22 it's around and it's sort of chaotic and
37:25 I think she was trying to do it without
37:27 making making it clear that she was
37:29 doing it I'll be honest it definitely
38:31 seemed to me like it was possible that
38:33 there was one person behind her and one
38:34 person in front of them one of the
38:36 things that the defense had said is to
38:38 the jury you won't even be sure the
38:41 words are spoken by Bridge guy the guy
38:44 coming toward them and given how much it
38:46 moves around it's really not possible
38:49 for that to be briefly the the foam pans
38:52 down and you can see that road below
38:55 them where the defense would like to
38:57 argue that there was a vehicle there
38:60 that took them away that they may well
38:02 still argue that I think he did say even
38:04 that he thought Libby had gotten into a
38:06 car and Libby and Abby had gotten into a
38:09 car and gone somewhere but it is a
38:12 terrifying scene and even so you know
38:16 that Libby had the presence of mind to
38:19 do something about it to say I'm gonna
38:21 catch this guy he's not getting away
38:24 with this I'm going to film him and
38:26 people are going to see this and just it
38:30 made you want to stand up and shout for
39:33 Libby good for you I mean what what a
39:37 person you know what a what character
39:39 that just really shows the kind of
39:41 person she is and how much Superior she
39:44 is to whoever did this to her it's
39:47 anyway it was it was moving for that
39:50 reason because you realize and you could
39:53 see from the chaotic nature of it what
39:56 it must have have meant to her to film
39:60 this and why she did it you could really
39:02 see that you could kind of hear the
39:04 panic and what I'm guessing is aby's
39:06 voice but when she says there's no path
39:08 there for me to go
39:10 to there had been talk about one of the
39:12 girls said there's a gun I didn't hear
39:14 that but there was so much that we
39:16 couldn't hear the only audio enhanced
39:18 part was the down the hill I had no idea
39:22 I asked everyone around me most people
39:24 several people anyway even thought that
39:26 this wasn't the this wasn't the video
39:29 there must be another video that's what
40:31 I thought at first I thought well this
40:32 must be just a brief you know I don't
40:35 know how long it was 15 seconds turns
40:37 out I think it was 40 but it was just a
40:39 brief video and then we're going to get
40:41 the down the hill one because I never
40:43 heard the words down the hill in fact
40:45 nobody around me did I mean literally
40:47 nobody heard down the hill they could
40:49 all hear the girls say something like
40:52 there's no path and I the words I got
40:54 were there's no path there for me to go
40:56 to and but everybody heard a little bit
40:60 of that but nobody heard the down the
40:02 hill if it had not been from the
40:03 enhanced audio I don't think those words
40:05 would have been would have been Audible
40:08 for the jury or for
40:11 anybody let's see if there's anything
40:13 else I don't want to leave anything out
40:14 about that because we have waited for
40:16 this for absolutely forever and I do
40:19 think the the most moving part of it was
40:22 what it says about Libby and her
40:24 presence of mind and why she was doing
40:26 this and you can just see that that and
40:28 you can actually just see the the I
41:32 don't even know how you can do it but
41:33 you see the emotion behind why she's
41:36 doing this and you see the reason why
41:38 she's doing this and what it's costing
41:40 to try to do this without letting
41:42 anybody know at the same time I think it
41:45 has less value evidentiary than I had
41:49 hoped I mean I had really hoped there
41:50 would be maybe a clearer shot maybe
41:52 there would be more of it would be just
41:55 something where you could actually tell
41:57 was happening and who was doing what
41:59 because of the way it was filmed and
41:02 because she was afraid I think when she
41:04 filmed it there wasn't anything like
41:07 that but good I mean good on her isn't
41:11 strong enough I mean I I can't even tell
41:14 you what it makes me think about Libby I
41:16 just hat is off to that girl I tell you
41:21 what it has been kind of emotional I
41:23 mean seeing those pictures and
41:25 stuff all right so they also took still
41:29 shots from the video which he had
42:31 enhanced uh but they handed those out to
42:34 the jury so I did not get to see those
42:37 so I can't tell you what was in them one
42:39 of their goals was to make Bridge guy a
42:41 little clearer and I don't know if those
42:44 are that's the same as what was released
42:46 to the public or whether these were more
42:48 enhanced than
42:51 that they one of the things they did
42:54 with Libby's phone was kind of odd they
42:56 they kept doing doing new extractions
42:59 wasn't 100% clear why it may have been
42:03 that celebrite was releasing new
42:05 iterations and so they would get the new
42:08 ver newest latest version and they would
42:10 try her phone again in case any new data
42:13 came up at one point they even reached
42:15 out to Homeland Security and had custom
42:19 Homeland Security do an analysis of the
42:21 phone where they had some licensing or
42:23 some abilities was celebrate that the
42:26 local Indiana State police would not
42:28 have but in this particular case the the
43:32 witness admitted that every time that
43:34 happened there was a little bit of data
43:36 lost there was uh they went through each
43:40 time there was the phone was extracted
43:43 on February 15th and then again February
43:46 21st Homeland Security did it again then
43:48 there was another extraction October
43:50 11th and then another one in
43:53 2019 so in each of these instances there
43:56 was some data lost he said that is true
43:59 each time you plug in or extract data
43:01 you lose some but he also said that
43:05 doesn't mean and he reassured the jury
43:07 that doesn't mean text messages that
43:09 doesn't mean anything that is um the
43:14 kind of stuff you would expect to find
43:15 on a phone you're not losing emails
43:16 you're not losing text messages this is
43:18 underlying data that is being pulled
43:22 out he looked at there was also
43:25 reference really quickly in Cross
43:27 examination to the camera rooll on
43:29 Libby's phone having a photograph of
44:32 Libby Libby's own funeral now I think
44:36 the meaning behind that would be that
44:38 the phone was taken returned to her
44:40 family used and one of the things they
44:42 did was take a photograph with it at her
44:45 funeral and then it was returned to law
44:47 enforcement so I think the the point was
44:50 other people have had this phone family
44:52 members have had this phone so we can't
44:54 really trust the data but since it had
44:56 already been searched once before that I
44:58 didn't feel like that completely undid
44:00 it but we may learn more about that it
44:02 was done so quickly that it was a little
44:04 bit difficult to understand what exactly
44:06 the defense was trying to
44:08 suggest there was also talk in the
44:10 defense cross-examination about the
44:13 longitude and latitude being nowhere
44:16 near the bridge so what the witness
44:18 explained was from a video you can
44:20 actually get location data it's not just
44:24 that you see the bridge it's also that
44:27 you can see where the longitude and
44:29 latitude are and in this particular case
45:31 in Libby's video you see the bridge you
45:34 actually see it briefly as the camera
45:37 pans up and apparently I guess you can
45:39 also see Bridge guy it was so quick and
45:42 the angle so bad I didn't see that but
45:44 like I say that is the video so I
45:46 believe it's on there and longitude and
45:49 latitude suggested it wasn't near the
45:51 bridge well we know it was we could see
45:53 the bridge in the video and so the
45:55 defense is saying well maybe this data
45:58 is unreliable maybe we can't really
45:60 count on it another point that offense
45:03 made was that fine my iPhone was enabled
45:06 and they tried to ask well isn't find my
45:08 iPhone something parents often use to
45:10 trap their children and that was
45:12 sustained there was the witness was not
45:14 allowed to answer that so I think the
45:17 reason that the defense asks this is to
45:19 suggest well you the Germans said we're
45:22 out looking for your daughter why didn't
45:24 you just use find my iPhone
45:27 not only do I think it would be very
45:29 difficult to make a good argument there
46:32 but also I can tell you why I can
46:34 guarantee you that in 2017 I had no idea
46:38 how to use fine my iPhone would it have
46:40 been a great idea should I have probably
46:42 been using it then to trap my children
46:44 probably so but I didn't know how to do
46:46 that in 2017 and I'm sure that's a
46:48 pretty clear answer about why the
46:50 Germans weren't using that if I mean
46:52 they did call AT&T and asked them to
46:55 Ping Libby's phone so they were doing
46:56 all they could to find her I don't I
46:58 don't think the fact that they weren't
46:00 using find my iPhone means anything
46:02 other than that they didn't even know it
46:04 was possible or they didn't know how to
46:06 use it if they did know it was
46:08 possible all right so we've been through
46:10 the data that was lost when the cell is
46:13 turned on and
46:14 off and there were additional
46:16 coordinates found by another sergeant in
46:19 2024 according to a defense question but
46:21 this witness didn't know anything about
46:23 it so we didn't find out that'll be
46:25 interesting I don't see how they can be
46:27 anywhere except at the bridge because we
46:29 see the bridge but maybe these
47:32 coordinates will come later when the
47:34 phone reactivated at 4:33 the next
47:37 morning and there were text messages
47:39 downloaded that would be fascinating if
47:41 we get any information like that the
47:44 duror questions were what was the
47:46 February 13th time when the longitude
47:50 latitude in other words what when you
47:53 got this longitude and latitude data
47:55 what time was it and the answer was
47:58 213 the next question what information
47:01 is on the knowledge seed database and
47:04 there have been talk about the knowledge
47:06 seed being something Apple had installed
47:08 in its in its various um computers cell
47:12 phones and other devices and this
47:15 knowledge seene was not known people
47:17 didn't know it was there so as a result
47:19 celebrite wasn't searching it it wasn't
47:21 looking there then that became known and
47:23 celebrite started to look there so the
47:26 witness just said well when we as soon
47:28 as celebrite knew about it they started
48:30 looking there all right more juror
48:33 questions was the report from 1017 from
48:36 ISP Indiana State Police or Homeland
48:39 Security answer Indiana State Police was
48:43 a knowledge SE database produced by
48:46 Homeland Security and they said we
48:48 believe it was there in the method three
48:50 extraction that the homeland security
48:52 did that was a type of extraction but at
48:56 that point nobody knew about this
48:58 knowledge seed so nobody knew what they
48:00 were looking at or
48:02 for this is obviously one juror with a
48:05 whole lot of technical knowledge so
48:07 that's going to be a hard thing for the
48:09 for the lawyers because now they know
48:11 there's somebody on there and they're
48:12 going to have to figure out how on Earth
48:15 they are going to come get this person
48:17 to to follow along how are they going to
48:20 give them enough information so they can
48:22 buy what is being said next question as
48:26 of two 2017 February 2017 were you aware
48:30 of any deleted photos or videos witness
49:33 said no and do Snapchat photo saved to a
49:36 person's phone one of the one of the
49:39 photographs Libby had taken was a
49:41 Snapchat photo and the witness said well
49:44 it could be in the Snapchat database but
49:46 I don't really know so they didn't get a
49:48 firm final answer on that final question
49:52 could an iPad associated with iCloud
49:54 have pulled the location of the part and
49:58 the answer oh there is one more um so
49:01 then final question did you ever
49:03 photograph the lck stream before you
49:06 locked it to show notifications since it
49:09 was last accessed and he said he didn't
49:11 think so both of those questions were a
49:13 little bit over my head so there you
49:15 have it and for those of you who know
49:17 what they're talking about please put
49:18 that in the chat for all of us so we can
49:21 figure out what it was that the juror
49:23 was talking about all I can say is that
49:25 juror knows a lot more about the
49:27 underlying technology than I
49:30 do all right so miss constru has been a
50:33 member for six months that is awesome so
50:37 glad Miss constru and uh yes I do I am
50:41 really wanting to go to bed tonight all
50:43 right Megan o thank you so much I
50:46 appreciate it chrisy thank you Christy a
50:49 painter's daughter Vicky Smith is a new
50:53 member Kate's meow thank you so much and
50:57 uh Bethany uh has anyone asked to borrow
50:00 my notes yes I've loan my notes out we
50:02 also sit back there I'll be like did you
50:05 get this you know this I'll draw a
50:06 little circle over here that means ask
50:08 somebody else and they'll ask me did you
50:10 get this what time was that what was the
50:13 word he said here so there's a lot of
50:15 camaraderie and sharing I think there is
50:18 widely perceived need to get this
50:22 information out to the public and I
50:23 think most of the people there really
50:25 feel like this is a that's being offered
50:28 that we really want to be able to
50:29 provide this to you so that you have the
51:32 chance to know what's happening so that
51:34 this is a public trial despite the
51:36 difficulties and they are
51:38 many all right so um now after lunch was
51:43 a little quicker we went through a bunch
51:45 of uh Witnesses I mean it wasn't quicker
51:47 in time but it was quicker in terms of I
51:49 think there's less we have to go over
51:51 I'm trying to give you a full and
51:52 complete yet brief overview of the day
51:56 so um where did Bethany thank you so
51:59 much and wow y'all are overwhelming me
51:02 thank you so much Joanne thank you I
51:05 appreciate it and Jenny thank you Jenny
51:09 and anyone anyone that's a great name
51:12 Robert Elliot thank you for the super
51:14 sticker and Kathy thank you very much I
51:18 have many many people I'm gonna dive
51:19 back in because I don't want everybody
51:21 to get bored as I look at this but I
51:23 just want to tell you how much I
51:24 appreciate each and every one of you all
51:27 right so after lunch Jeremy Chapman
51:30 testified he is an Indiana State Police
52:32 assistant administrator and AV
52:34 technician he is the guy who enhanced
52:37 the video using some programs he found
52:39 three frames as I mentioned earlier he
52:41 could enhance he found one audio clip
52:44 that he enhanced that was the only one
52:46 he enhanced was the male voice at the
52:48 end and I did wonder why because there
52:50 was other there were other statements by
52:53 a female voice and it was a young
52:56 sounding very high pitched female voice
52:59 which is why I thought maybe it was more
52:01 Abby than Libby but it could have been
52:03 both of them and also Libby may have
52:05 been focused on trying to get this on
52:07 film one of the things we heard about
52:09 her I think from her grandmother was
52:10 that she had been she had watched a show
52:13 where there was a female detective or
52:15 someone who was helping the police solve
52:16 crimes and she wanted to do that and
52:19 ironically she did she did or at least
52:22 she she did her best we'll put it
52:24 whether she's managed or or the ISP a
52:27 manag she sure did she sure did her
53:31 best he believes the words that are said
53:34 are gued down the hill there was an
53:35 objection the prosecutor asked him what
53:38 do you believe the male is saying 100%
53:41 objectionable I think I couldn't believe
53:43 that was allowed the objection was
53:45 unduly suggestive and yeah yeah and also
53:49 it's something it's the province of the
53:51 jury to decide what he says but he gave
53:53 his opinion guys down the hill one of
53:56 the things they've been talking about in
53:57 the trial was girls down the hill and no
53:00 one had heard that before and this
53:03 witness said guys down the hill okay the
53:06 enhanced images um are changed he said
53:10 and he did take some sounds out in order
53:12 to enhance IT background noise and so
53:14 forth he filtered out the next witness
53:16 Riley Vorhees lived in Deli in 2017 she
53:21 was a 10th grader and she was in the
53:23 park the day that Abby and Libby were uh
53:27 objective they were they were younger
53:29 they were eighth graders but you know
54:31 roughly friends of hers on social media
54:33 for example they knew of each other and
54:35 she personally went every day to the
54:37 trails that particular day she went with
54:39 two of her sisters and Brianna
54:41 Wilson they saw a person she remembered
54:44 the person that day when they were
54:47 almost to freedom Bridge so
54:50 let's will this one do it for us yeah it
54:53 will okay so see Freedom bridge to the
54:56 far left left there that's one end of
54:59 the park and then the park runs from
54:01 Freedom bridge to your right there both
54:03 on the North and South sides of that
54:05 Creek and it kind of runs along there
54:08 there trails and then there's right in
54:10 the middle the monan High Bridge where
54:12 the trail can cross to the other side so
54:15 the girls were that day uh the girls who
54:20 were taking a walk went started at the
54:22 freedom bridge and they were almost back
54:24 to it for the day they had left home
54:26 around 11:30 and they were almost back
54:28 to it back to Freedom bridge when they
55:31 saw somebody who didn't say hi back
55:33 glared at me and seemed not to be a
55:36 happy person they F she this witness
55:38 found it unsettling and she said to your
55:40 friends he seems to be unhappy and she
55:43 said her friends didn't seem to notice
55:45 him she was the only one who noticed him
55:49 the person she saw was suspicious or
55:51 stood out because he was overdressed for
55:53 the weather his face was covered he was
55:56 wearing a hat and he was
55:59 Caucasian he had a mask over the tip of
55:01 his nose not covering his eyes and a hat
55:04 and a heavy coat with a hood and his
55:06 hands in his pockets she said admitted
55:09 she had seen the bridge guy image it was
55:12 widely distributed and that she realized
55:16 as soon as she saw it she said that it
55:18 was the man she saw on the trail now the
55:23 cross-examination wow uh it was it out
55:26 just kind of take you through it the
55:28 witness said she had to be home by 2:30
56:32 she had to be at her friend Brie so she
56:34 was at her friend Bree's house dropping
56:36 Bri off by 2:20 so she could be home by
56:39 2:30 so that meant she would have gotten
56:41 to the opening there at the end of
56:43 Freedom bridge at the right where the
56:46 Trail Ends there at about 2:15 p.m. she
56:49 said so the man had to have been there
56:52 before that and whether he was leaving
56:55 or not that may be debated he was in all
56:58 this is what she said in her statements
56:59 he was in all black she said he seemed
56:01 dark maybe because of his unhappy
56:04 Behavior she told Steve mullen's The Who
56:08 law enforcement one of the lead
56:09 investigators Steve Mullen that he she
56:12 was he the man was wearing a black
56:14 hoodie pants a mask and a face covered
56:16 by black cloth and the defense pointed
56:21 out that she could only see the man from
56:24 here to here so that's not exactly a
56:26 great way to identify somebody when all
56:28 you can see of them is that much just
57:30 upper part of the nose and the eyebrows
57:32 and the eyes so the 2017 in 2017 she
57:36 gave a statement to law enforcement and
57:38 the defense went through this in which
57:40 she said the person she had seen the man
57:43 was in his early 20s or 30s was a bigger
57:47 build was
57:49 muscular and had dirty blonde hair
57:53 sticking out of the hoodie that was
57:55 Curly
57:57 that is kind of if you were to put
57:59 Richard Allen on one end of the spectrum
57:01 and that person just subscribed on the
57:03 other end of the spectrum they are way
57:06 miles apart he is very small about 5
57:10 foot five his lawyer said he's um small
57:14 he not muscular he has dark hair
57:16 although right now he's totally shaved
57:18 at the time he had a beard and according
57:22 to the net statement that she made he
57:25 had curly hair brown eyes wrinkly face
57:27 and a square jaw then in a 2021
58:31 statement uh she talked about different
58:34 things she even stated she thinks her
58:36 memory has been affected by what she has
58:39 seen it was I I tell you it was so
58:43 inconsistent her testimony it just
58:46 really didn't make a lot of sense um she
58:49 said she saw the bridge guy at 2115 the
58:52 person she believes is Bridge guy but
58:54 who is a young person with curly blonde
58:56 hair sticking out of a hoodie who's
58:58 muscular and of a bigger build so she
58:01 says she saw him at 2115 and maybe she
58:03 should
58:05 um let's see she's not one who
58:09 photograph oh oh oh this was a really
58:13 interesting point remember that Libby F
58:17 photographs or videos Richard Allen if
58:20 it's Richard Allen she she videos bridg
58:22 guy I should put it that way I think it
58:24 was at
58:25 213 meanwhile at 2:15 on the other end
58:29 of the park these girls are seeing this
59:33 person they say as Bridge guys so the
59:36 times don't match on that and though it
59:39 was a little odd to me they didn't lean
59:42 into that and say well this was
59:43 absolutely Richard Allen don't you think
59:45 this is exactly who you saw because then
59:47 they have him at 2:15 and he's on the
59:49 other side of the park when the video is
59:52 being made by
59:54 Libby and I have to double check my time
59:57 I think that's what it was was 213 she
59:59 asked the question about
59:01 213 the the witness's explanation was
59:04 well she'd just never been asked to
59:06 estimate stuff before she was young that
59:09 she saw bridg guy in the media and she
59:11 was certain it was the man she had seen
59:13 that the pictures she admitted the
59:15 pictures she saw might have influenced
59:17 her memory but now she is positive the
59:19 man she saw was Bridge guy and the
59:22 defense just said okay you you say
59:25 Bridge guy right and she said yeah and
59:27 they said okay and they showed a picture
59:28 of bridge guy who's wearing a a lighter
60:31 jacket not light but like light blue
60:33 maybe and jeans and they said you said
60:36 he was wearing black jeans a black
60:37 jacket a black hat and a black mask and
60:40 none of those are on bridge guys so that
60:42 was the way the cross-examination went
60:45 the next witness Brianna Wilbur also
60:47 there that day with the first witness
60:50 Vorhees and talked about at 12:43 taking
60:53 a picture of the high bridge and then at
60:55 1:26 six on their way back taking a
60:58 picture next to one of the benches more
60:60 sign posting of the time frame when they
60:02 were in the park that someone caught her
60:05 attention on the way out it a warmer day
60:07 but this person was wearing too many
60:08 layers in a deer jacket I'm not sure
60:11 what that is and the way he was walking
60:13 caught her attention he was walking with
60:15 a purpose everyone says hi to each other
60:18 hi back but this guy didn't and gave her
60:20 weird Vibes she told law enforcement
60:24 however that the guy had something
60:26 covering ing his nose and mouth had his
60:28 head down you couldn't see his hair was
61:30 he maybe wearing a cap blue or black
61:33 jacket and blue pants so it was really
61:36 different stories the cross-examination
61:39 said well you know was by Baldwin one of
61:42 um a lot of fun to watch him do a
61:44 cross-examination and he said the guy
61:46 creeped you out right shows a picture of
61:48 BG and you stood as high as his upper
61:51 forearm isn't that what you told law
61:53 enforcement she said' well I just
61:55 guessed at it he said 'well you you
61:57 would say he was a taller guy right and
61:59 she had to kind of at least admit that
61:00 much and you told law enforcement he was
61:03 muscular in the August 2020 statement
61:05 she said yeah and a younger guy said
61:07 well I'm not sure well did you tell and
61:10 so it went like that and she says well I
61:12 was just 16 she said well but did you
61:15 see a guy who was 20 and brown and curly
61:18 hair and she didn't recall the bottom
61:20 line is if she only came up to the guy's
61:23 upper forearm then that was a really
61:26 really tall fellow I mean that guy had
61:28 to have been very
61:30 tall the next witness Betsy
62:33 Blair uh said she had seen a man on the
62:35 bridge and she saw two girls Abby and
62:38 Libby she found out they were later she
62:40 didn't know them at the time at least I
62:43 don't think she knew either of them she
62:44 may have known Libby I don't think so
62:46 though okay she saw an image of rich guy
62:49 from the image from Libby's phone and
62:52 said I recognized him as a guy I saw on
62:54 the bridge she saw him 50 feet away and
62:56 he looked at me like he was expecting
62:58 somebody or something and I felt like he
62:01 wasn't looking for me so I turned around
62:04 that's relevant because the defense has
62:07 made a suggestion that and they haven't
62:09 fully fleshed it out but one of the
62:11 arguments I think they would have made
62:12 about third party culprit is that if
62:15 only they've been allowed to fully
62:17 present this evidence and they will make
62:20 at least a profer of it that they
62:21 believed the girls were meeting someone
62:23 at the park and maybe that person
62:25 abducted them
62:28 they at this point she said she'd
63:31 already mentioned sketch once in the in
63:34 the direct examination and
63:37 now the now she was asked they asked you
63:40 to identify the person and it was hard
63:42 right this well this is her first
63:43 mention in the prosecution asked that
63:45 and she said yeah they asked me to do a
63:47 sketch huge issue for for both sides
63:51 because the prosecution has gotten the
63:53 judge to rule out the sketches that were
63:55 made bu an artist the defense asked for
63:58 that they wanted one sketch in they
63:01 didn't want both primary sketches and in
63:04 fact there ultimately were four
63:05 different sketches all of which looked
63:07 in my view wildly different none of them
63:09 looked exactly the same so on
63:12 cross-examination she stepped into that
63:15 again the sketch issue the the
63:18 cross-examination asked well you
63:20 recognized he was in his 20s or 30s
63:22 right and have brown poofy hair and she
63:25 and that you said he was more boyish
63:27 looking and beautiful in appearance he
63:29 was of average height he didn't seem
64:31 short he had no facial hair didn't see a
64:33 hat on him so you can see these are just
64:36 all contradictory with each other and
64:38 they're contradictory with Richard Allen
64:40 the prosecution is trying to make all of
64:42 these into one person Richard Allen none
64:46 of these subscriptions seem to fit
64:47 Richard Allen and they don't even match
64:49 with each other so that's going to be a
64:51 serious
64:53 challenge she she said when and this was
64:56 where I think they may have just opened
64:59 the door wide to those sketches when I
64:02 said he was younger this person I was
64:04 describing I was comparing two sketches
64:08 so she offered that on defense and she'd
64:10 already mentioned it during the direct
64:12 so I don't know they asked the judge to
64:15 let it in they had a sidebar I mean we
64:17 couldn't hear but you could tell what it
64:18 was and then after the jury left for the
64:20 day they said to the judge well we need
64:22 to we need to raise that issue of the
64:24 sketches clearly the judge judge had
64:26 ruled against them said no sketches are
64:28 coming in and they wanted to argue it
65:30 and then I think they said they would
65:31 just file something in writing and so
65:33 we'll get a brief or something like that
65:36 will be filed so there were several
65:38 juror questions what was your distance
65:40 to the man on the bridge 50 feet in that
65:43 distance how could you determine he was
65:46 looking for someone great question right
65:49 really good and the witness had a pretty
65:52 good answer she said his posture you
65:53 know how he was standing he was facing
65:55 Upstream
65:57 the next question you stated the man
65:59 have poofy hair could you have mistaken
65:01 a hat for hair so somebody looking to
65:05 connect Bridge guy with a hat to this
65:08 poofy hair description and she said yes
65:11 she might have mistaken
65:13 that there was some quick testimony then
65:16 from Steve Mullen who has already been
65:18 on the stand once one of the lead
65:20 investigators about reviewing video from
65:22 the hooer Harvest store on February 14th
65:25 so what they did was when they were
65:27 trying to figure out where the girls
65:30 were and shortly after they found them
66:32 they pulled this video from the hoer
66:34 Harvest store which is right across from
66:36 an entrance to the park and they watched
66:39 cars go back and forth along a road that
66:41 runs along the side of the park so they
66:44 found numerous people who matched with
66:48 their descriptions or they were able to
66:50 pinpoint time so for example they talked
66:52 about finding he talked about finding
66:54 Betsy Blair's vehicle Kelsey Germans
66:57 that's Libby's sister who dropped her
66:58 off at the park so that pinpointed when
66:01 the girls arrived at the park and Sarah
66:03 carboss so we'll put all of that into
66:06 our timeline which will be coming
66:08 someday soon as soon as I have time to
66:10 get that well all right we'll do a very
66:13 few questions I am worn out so I'm
66:15 headed to bed uh Allison thank you so
66:18 much anyone who's ever minut attat
66:20 wishes they could have filmed their
66:21 attackers I'll say and you know it is so
66:24 true everyone wishes they had a
66:26 friendship like aby's and Libby's I will
66:28 tell you what one of the things I loved
66:29 the most was the testimony that Abby
67:33 didn't have a cell phone Libby did well
67:35 you know Abby wanted a cell phone she
67:37 was in eighth grade and her mother
67:39 testified that she was gonna get one
67:40 when she got to high school but for now
67:42 no cell phone so Libby put both of their
67:46 fingerprints their lib um Abby could use
67:49 her phone anytime her fingerprint opened
67:51 Libby's phone I just oh I loved that
67:54 loved that Tom 23 thank you so much Tom
67:58 23 for the super sticker uh Paulie 1984
67:02 how does the prosecution explain the
67:04 phone coming back on at 4:30 a.m. there
67:06 is no explanation yet I feel sure we'll
67:09 get something but for right now no
67:12 answer yet uh QuickBooks Online tips and
67:15 tricks is a new member thank you Wes
67:19 Jackson thank you so much Wes and Sharon
67:23 thank you very much uh clever nit name
67:26 I'll be there Saturday line set yes I am
67:29 going to I do need I've gotten a few
68:31 people writing me I'm so busy I don't
68:33 even have time to write you back also I
68:35 don't have my phone all day but I am
68:37 going to ask for some help doing line
68:38 sitting because I'm not going to be able
68:40 to continue this and I would like to
68:42 cover the trial as much as possible I'm
68:44 G to have to make some adjustments I
68:46 don't know exactly what but I'm going to
68:48 do something so yes clever nickname uh
68:51 write me on my gmail which you'll find
68:55 under if you go to the lawyerly page on
68:57 YouTube you can find under the I forget
68:60 if it's under about or Community
68:01 somewhere in there you can find that
68:04 information La Mac thank you I
68:07 appreciate that and it's been an honor
68:09 to cover it but also one of the harder
68:11 things I've ever done I never
68:14 experienced so much physical involvement
68:16 in deal in you know doing something
68:19 connected to the law it's not this much
68:23 uh thank you Glen f it does need eyes on
68:25 it I totally agree with you and thank
68:27 you Nel T y'all are y'all are
68:29 overwhelming me and I'm so appreciative
69:32 simcha thank you cara B thank you very
69:36 much Cara and
69:38 tiger and uh Michael uh yes I did see
69:42 that and Laura H thank you yeah I do
69:46 need to get some rest all right we'll
69:48 we'll come over and answer a few
69:49 questions and then I have some more
69:50 people to thank after that so let's
69:52 check out what some of the questions
69:54 are and let's see oh I totally forgot
69:58 put your question marks at the front and
69:59 that gives me a much better chance of um
69:02 finding them so please put them in the
69:05 front all right I'm and many of you
69:08 already knew that so I'm grateful for
69:09 that thank you all right I'm not going
69:12 to go way back I'm just going to start
69:13 right here wherever I find the next one
69:16 um you hope I haven't eaten I just
69:19 wanted to say thank you oh well thank
69:20 you I appreciate
69:22 it and let's see Diane is asking if
69:26 there's a retrial or appeal do you think
69:27 it will be made public thank you for all
69:29 you're doing so you know it's the
70:32 decisions around the publicity and the
70:34 way the trial has been conducted have
70:36 been made by the judge so unless the
70:38 judge changes I would imagine that the
70:40 net trial would have many of the same
70:42 characteristics unless there's a
70:44 specific request from the appellant
70:46 court to change something about it and
70:48 either in order or just comments made so
70:50 that the judge feels it has to be
70:52 changed the other option would be that
70:54 the judge could be removed but three
70:56 times the Supreme Court has refused to
70:58 do that and it's really really hard to
70:01 get a judge removed I would I would
70:03 think that would be very difficult and
70:05 the Supreme Court has made it clear it
70:06 will be
70:08 difficult all right let's see who else
70:10 um Maria could the hair be transfer
70:13 evidence I would I think the what
70:16 they're looking at is the root of the
70:17 hair itself may have DNA but it's
70:20 probably going to match a female
70:22 relative of Libby so it doesn't seem
70:24 like it's all that significant it like
70:26 it's going to change anything for the
70:28 defense D Laura how do the attorneys
71:31 decide who to line up as Witnesses does
71:33 the prosecution put on the strongest
71:35 part of their case first that is such an
71:38 interesting question done Laura and that
71:39 really depends on what they have to
71:41 prove one of the things you have to do
71:43 is lay a foundation for evidence so you
71:46 can't just come in in the first day and
71:47 have somebody come up and say okay so
71:49 there was DNA then it matched to soand
71:52 so well DNA of what what are you talking
71:54 about so first first you have to find
71:57 the hair then you have to collect the
71:59 hair and then you have to show the chain
71:60 of custody of the Care sometimes that's
71:02 all one witness and sometimes it takes
71:04 more than one then you have to have the
71:05 DNA tested and that's when you'll be
71:07 able to give finally the answer so there
71:10 are foundations that you have to lay
71:12 before you can go ahead and put some of
71:15 this information into evidence so that
71:17 confines you to some degree what they
71:20 clearly have decided to do is start with
71:22 just the facts what happened to Abby and
71:24 Libby and taking you through their day
71:28 how their bodies were found the just the
72:31 finding of the video they're doing it
72:33 very methodically very slowly marching
72:35 through the facts of the case we are not
72:37 anywhere near really Richard Allen yet
72:39 we haven't really found out anything
72:41 about Richard Allen's connection we've
72:43 had a lot of talk about Bridge guy but
72:46 nothing that says Bridge guy is Richard
72:48 Allen we've had a lot of talk about
72:50 unspent casing but nothing yet to say
72:52 unspent casing connects to Richard Allen
72:55 that's the kind of thing that we're
72:56 waiting for and that is just a decision
72:59 made by the prosecutor they just decide
72:01 whenever and Ellis are you surprised by
72:04 the lack of Hard Evidence I am surprised
72:07 there's plenty of evidence in the sense
72:09 that there is a lot of information from
72:12 the crime scene but the connection to
72:14 Richard Allen isn't really strong but
72:17 obviously we really have to hear those
72:19 confessions are they as unhinged was he
72:22 as mentally unstable as he thought we
72:24 will just find out
72:28 uh so Jennifer where was the Len L was
73:31 it somewhere else I don't know what the
73:33 Ellen L is I'm sorry I can't answer that
73:37 um pug and spice do you think ra will
73:39 take the stand under no circumstances
73:42 will he take the stand not only is that
73:44 generally something that people advise
73:46 against but I'm still not convinced that
73:48 he is all that U mentally recovered yet
73:52 so I I just think it would be disastrous
73:54 if he were to attempt to do that
73:56 uh Wine Woman Nappa thank you for the
73:59 super sticker I let me head back over
73:02 and there may be some questions in there
73:04 as well so let me make sure that I get
73:06 everybody okay
73:08 so
73:10 um Laura thank you I appreciate that I
73:13 can't remember exactly where I was let's
73:15 see I think I thanked KS but if not
73:17 thank you KS and Chuck thank you and
73:21 Alex Alexis is a new
73:23 member uh no one thank you thank you I
73:26 appreciate it very much uh
73:29 CBC Wine Woman Napa thank you I better
74:32 get these up quick while I'm talking and
74:34 Penny deal I appreciate all of you very
74:37 very
74:38 much B Campo super sticker thank you
74:42 bampo and Laura and Eminem y'all are
74:45 overwhelming thank you so much I really
74:47 do appreciate it so let's answer just a
74:49 couple more questions and then I am out
74:51 of here until tomorrow let's see what
74:54 else don't for oh there we go bet C Su
74:57 why is access to this specific case so
74:59 restricted it relates to the decisions
74:02 the court has made uh at the beginning
74:04 if you one of the first things I talked
74:05 about and you'll have to scroll back if
74:07 you're coming into the live late is that
74:09 in the front of the courtroom are these
74:11 two things sitting on either side of
74:13 this raised bench and then there's one
74:15 in the courtroom and they have black
74:17 trash bads wrapped on them I what is
74:20 that I'd heard from somebody what are
74:21 those black trash bags and I was
74:24 puzzling over that and asked somebody
74:25 the courtroom it turns out they're TVs
74:27 or cameras they're cameras so this could
74:30 be televised but the judge has decided
75:32 it's not and the judge has decided
75:34 there's no overflow room with video
75:36 projection into the Overflow room
75:38 there's no audio that's going to be
75:40 released to the public as the trial
75:42 progresses or video with audio that
75:44 would be released nothing is going to be
75:46 released so at this point it's just very
75:48 locked down it's very difficult to get
75:50 in a lot of seats has have been allotted
75:53 as they should be to Media which doesn't
75:55 include YouTube and to the families both
75:59 sides so those seats are taken and then
75:02 there's just not a lot left over so it's
75:04 difficult to get
75:05 in um Beyond fire do you think Bridge
75:08 guy is a killer or just a random I am um
75:11 going to I always try to maintain
75:13 neutrality until we get to the end of
75:15 the case so I'm going to try to do that
75:17 again here and I don't know the answer
75:20 certainly it looks bad we'll put it that
75:23 way uh Beth Bo ask when transparent
75:26 is critical can the American citizen
75:28 complain somewhere there are certain
75:29 individual things that you can complain
76:31 about for example uh you can complain
76:33 about maybe the release of the audio
76:35 recordings anything that there's a
76:37 statutory right to most of this will
76:39 just be reserved for appeal around the
76:42 evidence that's kept out but a lot of
76:44 this stuff isn't really anything I mean
76:48 assigning only 24 seats to the public
76:51 and refusing to put rules around it well
76:53 there's nothing really to appeal on that
76:55 there's nobody who has oversight of that
76:57 that's just a choice being
76:00 made all right let's see Patty bromfeld
76:04 after seeing the video do you think it
76:05 looks like Richard Allen you
76:09 see when it's not slowed down you see
76:12 less of Richard Allen than you did in
76:15 the clip that the government had given
76:17 out earlier that the state had passed
76:19 out I there was nothing extra in it that
76:22 suggested it was Richard Allen it's the
76:24 same videotape we saw before and you
76:26 just really can't tell there are stories
76:29 around here that everybody in the entire
77:33 I don't know 40 mile radius they would
77:35 put Bridge guy up and the when it was a
77:38 still shot and they would put a person
77:40 of the picture of somebody else up and
77:42 they were person after person after
77:44 person was compared to bridge guy and
77:46 everybody thought well this could be the
77:48 guy my neighbor my friend my
77:49 brother-in-law whatever could be Bridge
77:52 guy and that was some that he apparently
77:56 had characteristics that people thought
77:58 looked like anybody and everybody so I I
77:00 don't think there's enough from uh for
77:03 me to be able to say for sure that
77:05 that's Richard Allen I can't tell you at
77:07 the time one other thing he did have
77:10 facial hair so that isn't ruled out with
77:12 Bridge guy but is ruled out by some of
77:14 the descriptions by the witnesses that
77:16 the person didn't have facial
77:19 hair all right so uh Evan marer juile
77:23 Bridge guy got close to Aly in the video
77:25 you mentioned you heard a girl with a
77:27 high-pitch voice squeal um yeah it was
77:30 more like a whimper like almost a cry
78:33 and right before she says I don't that
78:36 whatever those words were about you know
78:37 there's no way for me there's no path
78:39 for me to go
78:41 down uh so how close would you say the
78:43 suspect got honestly you can't tell
78:46 anything about it and you can't really
78:48 hear what he says they enhanced it
78:51 otherwise you would have no idea you can
78:53 hear what I'm guess in is Abby but
78:56 nothing else and the part where
78:58 supposedly Abby says there's a gun or
78:00 someone does I don't hear that maybe it
78:03 was just a rumor it wasn't anything that
78:06 ever came out in court documents that I
78:07 heard Evan Mah do you believe oh same
78:10 question can the FBI agents initially
78:12 involved in the case be called yes I
78:15 think they could be if they're under
78:16 subpoena Beth hammer do you find the
78:19 local people helpful or unfriendly to
78:21 the YouTubers well I think for the most
78:23 part people have been unbelievably and
78:25 nice and I've seen that sort of
78:27 uniformly among the people I some among
79:31 some people I think there's some
79:32 resentment of the YouTubers and the idea
79:35 that they've come in from the outside
79:37 but I think there's also recognition
79:40 that this is an important case and I
79:41 think a lot of people here want eyes on
79:43 it and they definitely want it explained
79:45 they want someone to come in and say
79:47 Here's what's happening and the who has
79:49 time to go and sit in the trial all day
79:51 for a month and so if someone with a law
79:54 degree will do that for you and give you
79:56 their analysis in the end of the day
79:58 what they think is happening I think a
79:59 lot of people do appreciate that I've
79:01 been overwhelmed by how kind people have
79:03 been really just how nice locals have
79:05 been unbelievably great and it is a
79:08 pretty area just beautiful
79:11 place so that's my opinion uh jobber
79:15 floof wow that's a great name why does
79:17 everybody put all their chairs coats
79:19 pillows and such used while waiting in
79:22 line what where well where do you put
79:23 all that stuff so well um you there's
79:27 there are many things that aren't
79:28 allowed so you can't bring them you
80:30 can't bring stuff that you otherwise
80:32 would maybe want to have with you you
80:33 have to be careful to only bring things
80:35 that the court
80:36 allows uh all right Rea Bell please
80:40 subscribe Richard Allen and wife as
80:41 you've observed them and the answer is
80:44 they're not right together so you
80:46 there's not a lot you can see about
80:48 their interaction she sits a couple of
80:50 rows back um she a beautiful woman very
80:54 pretty woman and uh Richard Allen you
80:57 know is a lot of times I can't see him
80:59 at all based on depending on where I'm
80:01 sitting he's a bunch of people between
80:04 Richard Allen and me he sits
80:06 shoulder-to-shoulder with one of the
80:08 prosecutors all the time they moved the
80:09 two tables really tight together because
80:11 they need some room to move around on
80:13 the side near the jury so I mean he's
80:16 sitting right there next to the
80:17 prosecutor Prosecuting him it's a really
80:20 strange Affair and then behind him sit a
80:22 couple of guards so that's how they've
80:24 um made it safe and he's right there at
80:27 the council table always neat and
80:30 presentable will his voice be heard in
81:32 court on audio yes Mary I believe so
81:35 during the confessions we are going to
81:36 have some recordings of his
81:38 conversations with his wife and mother
81:40 from the jail so I do think we're going
81:42 to actually see
81:44 that Julie Melvin yes I do know Julie
81:47 Melvin and uh she has a great daughter
81:51 and uh or daughter's boyfriend or
81:53 son-in-law and I've enjoyed talking to
81:55 Julie there like there have been an
81:57 amazing number of people I mean I have
81:59 lists and lists of just these people
81:01 were all nice to me it just goes on and
81:03 on people have been really nice and
81:05 definitely uh Julie is
81:08 included all right so let's see how can
81:12 a defense not be able to produce
81:13 evidence I I think it was a mistake I do
81:16 feel like they should have been allowed
81:17 to present some at least of the third
81:20 party culprit evidence and I feel like
81:22 it was too broad to just say nothing you
81:25 know you don't get
81:27 anything all right some quick thanks Viv
82:30 super sticker thank you so much um
82:33 Teresa troll would like to see Libby get
82:35 a postumus honorary doctorate and
82:37 forensics wouldn't that be awesome that
82:39 would be so awesome I just I am
82:43 overwhelmed by that
82:44 girl Cara B and Raspberry Beret are both
82:48 Rasberry Beret vintage are both new
82:50 members welcome we are glad to have you
82:53 join us and thank you very much Spence
82:56 for the fun for people to stand in line
82:58 for you yes we we need that group we
82:01 have got to have that group because I
82:02 won't be able to keep it up at this pace
82:04 and I want to you know I want to
82:06 continue to cover this I think it's
82:08 important and I want to be able to get
82:09 that information to you but honestly no
82:12 one could sustain this with just you
82:13 know two hours of sleep on a night it's
82:15 just not even possible and the cold is
82:18 killing me I am not from around here we
82:21 put it there my blood is much thinner
82:26 uh let's see um Sr in the chat says they
82:29 live 30 minutes away and are willing to
83:31 line sit for me starting at midnight a
83:33 that's awesome that's fantastic so Sr
83:36 just needs to um communicate with me and
83:39 I I'm I'm asking because I'm at the end
83:42 of what I can do and I need some help
83:44 and so that's I don't know how else to
83:46 get it so I would really appreciate that
83:48 very much well I will see y'all tomorrow
83:50 night I'm trying really hard to go right
83:52 at 7 so that we can keep to our schedule
83:56 but I I can't always do it just because
83:59 sometimes by the time I get home from
83:00 court depending on how late we go and I
83:02 get my notes already ready so I can talk
83:04 to you it may take a little bit longer
83:06 but I'm aiming for seven and I will see
83:08 you soon I will see you tomorrow night
83:10 at 7
83:28 feel