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Username17
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### Ukraine is a bunch of Assholes.

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Post by Username17 » Wed Jan 07, 2009 10:11 pm

So Ukraine won't pay their bill for the natural gas that they contracted for, received, and used last year. So Russia won't give them a new contract or new gas until they pay their fucking bills.
Problem: Ukraine is in between several countries and Russia. So the pipelines go through their country to get to places like Hungary, Bulgaria, and Czech Republic. So yeah, there are people who are freezing to death in Brno because Ukraine is apparently run by a bunch of assholes.
The bill is for like 12 billion dollars. It's not like they couldn't pay the money, they just don't want to. And the EU is being all feeble about this shit. Apparently our threat is that if Ukraine and Russia don't find an agreement, that we're going to freeze to death and make them feel sorry.
This is bullshit. Ukraine's entire late fee is 600 million fucking dollars. That's ass-wipe money. Deutschland should just fucking pay it with their porno viewing budget. After that, someone needs to shoot Yushchenko in the face. Or give him some more dioxin. Whatever. I don't even care. The NUNS has been given way too much leeway. At the stage where they are literally murdering people in the European Union the time for hand wringing and smoke blowing is long over.
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JonSetanta
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Post by JonSetanta » Wed Jan 07, 2009 10:36 pm

And oh, what a porn export Ukraine has (svelte body big boobs) say what? Did I type that aloud...
Maybe Russia should just absolve the debt if Ukraine makes better quality porn.
What's the word on Russia's issue with Georgia? You know, that whole pipeline attack fairly recently. Is there really a war brewing or is Georgia still laughing stock of the ex-USSR?
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Post by Koumei » Thu Jan 08, 2009 1:14 am

> sigma999 wrote:And oh, what a porn export Ukraine has (svelte body big boobs) say what? Did I type that aloud...
> Maybe Russia should just absolve the debt if Ukraine makes better quality porn.

Nah, Czech Republic makes better porn than them. I have my suspicious that the real reason Frank studies there is in actual fact so he can audition for Lupus pictures.
Either that or so he can control the EU from the shadows by influencing the Czech guy who's currently the leader-ish.

> What's the word on Russia's issue with Georgia? You know, that whole pipeline attack fairly recently. Is there really a war brewing or is Georgia still laughing stock of the ex-USSR?

Last I heard, Georgia had been flattened and Russia decided to mostly withdraw just to be polite.
---
Frank: I was certain that the "You owe us money." "No we don't." thing was Ukraine's fault, but the media has taken great fondness in saying "RUSSIA IS BAD, REMEMBER THE COLD WAR! COMMUNISTS!"
I mean, okay, the gas company is practically part of Russia's government for all intents and purposes, but it's still a company, that keeps records and shit, and can theoretically get in trouble for not honouring a contract or just outright lying. Whereas Ukraine is a country (for now. If they continue to be dicks, I have high hopes for both East and West Europe using tanks to put them in an INVISIBLE SAMMICH), and can in fact just decide not to honour a contract, not being particularly accountable to anyone.
I can't figure out how this benefits Ukraine. Seriously, they can just pay the money and be done with it, and it's not even a big hit. If they think "Russia will be sad that people freeze to death because we're assholes, and so will gief gas anyway" then they are high as a fucking kite. Presumably Western Europe isn't so anti-Eastern Europe as to say "Bah, blame the Russians! Poor Ukraine!" and will actually try to pressure them into paying it (although if necessary, paying it for them then saying "You're in debt. Pay us, or there may be trouble. You want (anything Ukraine gets from EU)? Gief monies."
My girlfriend posits that they don't have the money to pay, and laughed at the suggestion that Ukraine even has a government. I mean, she's Swedish, and all Europeans make fun of the other European countries, but she may have a point.
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Post by Count Arioch the 28th » Thu Jan 08, 2009 5:04 am

This is off-topic, but I went to school with a Ukrainian girl. My got she was hot. I was an idiot for not trying to nail her, because I totally could. I instead went with the curvy, busty redhead. It didn't work for Al Bundy and it didn't work for me.
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Post by Cynic » Thu Jan 08, 2009 6:06 am

> Koumei wrote: Frank: I was certain that the "You owe us money." "No we don't." thing was Ukraine's fault, but the media has taken great fondness in saying "RUSSIA IS BAD, REMEMBER THE COLD WAR! COMMUNISTS!"

This is so fvcking true. I caught the tail end of a story on the Russia-Ukraine business on NPR and I grumbled to my wife about how Russia's always the bad guy.
The reply I got was that it's not our fault if Russia's always bad.
I was dumbfounded that this was coming from my wife of all people.

> Ancient History wrote:We were working on Street Magic, and Frank asked me if a houngan had run over my dog.

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Post by Absentminded_Wizard » Thu Jan 08, 2009 7:35 am

Even from the U.S.-centered CNN, the impression I got was that Russia was initially willing to let the gas flow to Europe, but the Ukrainians were siphoning gas off the pipeline in spite of not paying even last year's bill.
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Post by josephbt » Thu Jan 08, 2009 7:54 am

That's the point that pisses Russians the most, Ukraine siphoning the gas a.k.a. stealing it.
And since i'm from the part of the world that's getting less gas b/c of Ukraine - to hell with them. I seriously can't blame Russians if they turn off the gas when someone steals and doesn't pay that gas. However, the EUs stance simply infuriates me.
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Username17
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Post by Username17 » Thu Jan 08, 2009 7:57 am

Ukraine's position is that if Russia does not sell them gas at below market rate and give Ukraine a taste of every cubic meter that gets piped across their country to other nations that they won't pay last year's bill.
So basically they want Russia to wholesale to them while they retail downstream. Understandable as a life goal, but I'm not sure how they think they can win that argument. Russia physically owns the gas and has all the guns.
Basically this is a lot like Somalia committing piracy on a Chinese ship. Except imagine if China had a land border with Somalia.
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Koumei
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Post by Koumei » Thu Jan 08, 2009 11:47 am

Yeah, it can't possibly go down well for them. There just isn't a way they can win. Is Yushchenko simply that curious to see what tank shells look like?
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Post by Username17 » Thu Jan 08, 2009 2:11 pm

> Koumei wrote:Yeah, it can't possibly go down well for them. There just isn't a way they can win. Is Yushchenko simply that curious to see what tank shells look like?

New plan: we have John McCain personally assure Yushchenko that the United States has got his back. Then the problem resolves itself.
Edit:

> Koumei wrote:I have my suspicious that the real reason Frank studies there is in actual fact so he can audition for Lupus pictures.

Seriously, do they do anything other than spanking videos? Definitely not my thing.
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Last edited by Username17 on Thu Jan 08, 2009 2:44 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Koumei
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Post by Koumei » Fri Jan 09, 2009 2:00 am

> FrankTrollman wrote: New plan: we have John McCain personally assure Yushchenko that the United States has got his back. Then the problem resolves itself.

:rofl:

Heheh. Interestingly enough, I have a bunch of their stuff on a DVD, and a bad habit of not labelling discs. So I was trying to find it some time ago, and actually found myself saying "It's not Lupus". I only then realised the hilarity of the situation.

> Seriously, do they do anything other than spanking videos? Definitely not my thing.

Not really. I mean, we could argue semantics about whipping and caning, but they clearly fit into that category. To each their own, I won't fault a person for that not being their thing. Though I do appreciate that, for those who buy the legit DVDs, the bonus material has interviews with the cast, so it doesn't come across as "girls in poverty forced into this for money".
Incidentally, I notice that you didn't deny the suggestion that you're there to control the EU from the shadows.
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Post by Gelare » Fri Jan 09, 2009 3:06 am

Oh, so that's what's been going on there. I saw the headlines, but wasn't sure what they actually meant.
Current events, by FrankTrollman. Always good for a roflmao.
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Post by Username17 » Fri Jan 09, 2009 10:04 pm

> Gelare wrote: Current events, by FrankTrollman. Always good for a roflmao.

Yeah, events in Europe are a always a barrel of laughs.

> Koumei wrote:Not really. I mean, we could argue semantics about whipping and caning, but they clearly fit into that category. To each their own, I won't fault a person for that not being their thing.

Honestly, if there is a beautiful and receptive naked woman in front of me who is bent over a table and sticking her ass out at me I can think of at least five things to do just with my penis that are better than "hit her in the thighs with a stick."
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Koumei
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Post by Koumei » Sat Jan 10, 2009 2:36 am

Despite my obsession with it in my art and writing, and maybe a quarter of the porn I view, when it comes to that thing called the real world I could take it or leave it, depending on partner and mood. Because I actually rate cuddling and massaging much higher than spanking.
I just feel it's important that I dispel anyone's ideas that I have a bondage dungeon in my cellar.
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Post by Cynic » Sat Jan 10, 2009 6:51 am

> Koumei wrote:Despite my obsession with it in my art and writing, and maybe a quarter of the porn I view, when it comes to that thing called the real world I could take it or leave it, depending on partner and mood. Because I actually rate cuddling and massaging much higher than spanking.
> I just feel it's important that I dispel anyone's ideas that I have a bondage dungeon in my cellar.

This was supposed to dispel our ideas about this? No, No, you must be using diversionary tactics to keep us away from that very same dungeon.

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Post by Draco_Argentum » Sat Jan 10, 2009 10:45 am

> Koumei wrote:I just feel it's important that I dispel anyone's ideas that I have a bondage dungeon in my cellar.

You're Australian, you don't have a cellar. Unless its some form of southern thing.
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Post by Maxus » Sat Jan 10, 2009 4:28 pm

> Draco_Argentum wrote:

> > Koumei wrote:I just feel it's important that I dispel anyone's ideas that I have a bondage dungeon in my cellar.

> You're Australian, you don't have a cellar. Unless its some form of southern thing.

Oddly enough, I've almost never been in a house with a cellar or basement or anything similar.
Just don't seem to be popular around here...
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Post by Lago PARANOIA » Sat Jan 10, 2009 7:17 pm

What exactly does Ukraine expect to get out of this?
Also, if they are regularly going to act a fool about this then what's stopping Russia from just running a pipeline through Belarus or Latvia/Lithuania through Poland and beyond?

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Post by Judging__Eagle » Sat Jan 10, 2009 7:18 pm

> Koumei wrote:Despite my obsession with it in my art and writing, and maybe a quarter of the porn I view, when it comes to that thing called the real world I could take it or leave it, depending on partner and mood. Because I actually rate cuddling and massaging much higher than spanking.
> I just feel it's important that I dispel anyone's ideas that I have a bondage dungeon in my cellar.

One always wants what they can't get?
I'm betting that you'd have lots of cuddling and massaging porn if you didn't get your fill in real life.
Look at how popular extremely violent games are with people who never see violence in their lives.
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Post by Bigode » Sat Jan 10, 2009 7:39 pm

> Lago PARANOIA wrote:Also, if they are regularly going to act a fool about this then what's stopping Russia from just running a pipeline through Belarus or Latvia/Lithuania through Poland and beyond?

Wouldn't Russia running anything through Poland be a problem in itself?

> Judging__Eagle wrote:One always wants what they can't get?
> I'm betting that you'd have lots of cuddling and massaging porn if you didn't get your fill in real life.
> Look at how popular extremely violent games are with people who never see violence in their lives.

Does cuddling and massaging porn exist in significant amount? Not that I'm opposed to it, much the contrary - the world'd be a better place with less Japanese porn.

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Post by tzor » Sat Jan 10, 2009 7:47 pm

> Maxus wrote:Oddly enough, I've almost never been in a house with a cellar or basement or anything similar.

When my grandparents were living their last home was a "summer home" that was built with a minimal foundation over the generally Long Island sand that covers most of the island. They dug into the crawl space under the house and excavated walkable tunnels in the sand within the foundation.
My current house has something called a "basement" but since it actually has one of the four sides on ground level I suppose that would be an incorrect term for it.
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Post by Calibron » Sat Jan 10, 2009 9:08 pm

> Lago PARANOIA wrote:What exactly does Ukraine expect to get out of this?

Street Cred(or the national variation thereof)? 'Cause I don't see them getting anything else out of this, except maybe the sympathy of the selectively ignorant.
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Post by Koumei » Sun Jan 11, 2009 8:45 am

So now it looks like Yulia Tymoshenko (Ukrainian PM, who seems to have as much power as the Prez and opposes him on such subjects as "everything") met up with Commissar Putin, along with a Czech guy from the UN, and they made an agreement for getting monitors in place to turn the taps back on.
So no progress on Ukraine getting gas again (seeing as they still want it at crazy cheap prices after their history of being assholes, and Russia can't afford to look weak to it's people (and feels like it's given Ukraine enough freebies)), but at least, with any luck, Europe might get gas again, and fewer people will freeze to death.
Meanwhile, Slovakia is restarting its Nuclear reactors (which it had to shut down in order to join the EU, or in order to get certain benefits or something) because they're sick of not getting their gas (that they paid for).
So the important, immediate problem is getting tackled (momentarily at least). But plenty more is simmering. I can't see it going nicely. At least Yulia doesn't have such a history of pissing Russia off (meaning Vladimir is more likely to listen to her in the first place).
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Post by Username17 » Sun Jan 11, 2009 9:01 am

> Lago PARANOIA wrote:What exactly does Ukraine expect to get out of this?

Ukraine's set of demands is that they want the same cost sponsorship that Belarus gets despite the fact that Belarus gets that price support from the Russian government in exchange for an alliance with Russia, while Ukraine has begun a application to join NATO and form military alliance against Russia.
Also they want to receive a portion of the profit from every thousand cubic meters of gas that flows into the EU.
Note: Russia "sells" Natural Gas to Belarus at a loss, so Russia will literally never agree to this.

> Also, if they are regularly going to act a fool about this then what's stopping Russia from just running a pipeline through Belarus or Latvia/Lithuania through Poland and beyond?

There is a pipeline that goes through Belarus, and a pipeline in the south as well. The problem is that 80% of the current piping goes through Ukraine. It's problematic. It'll take quite a while to make the kind of piping needed to get gas to Europe in the quantities needed without using the existing pipeline in Ukraine.
Currently, the accord has been signed where international observers are going to be stationed along the pipeline in Ukraine, the gas will be turned on, and if Ukraine starts stealing it again Russia will shut it off again.
You can chck it out in Tomorrow's Paper

> The Age wrote:Ukraine has vehemently denied Russian accusations that it was "stealing" transit gas, and President Viktor Yushchenko said Friday such charges from Moscow were designed to "humiliate" his country.
> Tymoshenko said the agreement, signed for Ukraine by Deputy Prime Minister Grygory Nemyrya and the deputy chief of Ukraine's gas company Naftogaz, Volodymyr Trikolich, was "harsher" on Ukraine than a prior EU draft had been.

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Post by Username17 » Wed Jan 14, 2009 9:44 am

Update: Russia got the observers it wanted, so it turned the gas back on.
But Ukraine now says that they lack the technical capability to ship gas across the country so they won't let the gas in. Funny how as soon as international observers com in to see if they are stealing gas, the Ukrainians won't let gas into the pipes...
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