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the_taken
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### Ninja (geshtalt psion/rogue?) adventure

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Post by the_taken » Sat Mar 03, 2007 2:06 am

I have an idea for an adventure, which I would have it's theme loosely based apon the current hit ninja story world, Naruto.
While I can (and have) create the adventure's events and plot twists, I'm still in the dark as to what D&D rule modifications I need to create so as to keep my players from creating save-or-die slingers or nova-routine performers, but still reflecting the awesome power the characters in Naruto display.
I have a basis. Psionics 3.5. This system reflects the chakra pool the characters have, as well as Sasuke's technique stealing abilities. Bad news is it performs poorly at reflecting at what an incredibly efficient chakra user like Sakura does, and some approximations don't work 'till the extremely high level, or are unimpressive, even at high level. Like Naruto's.
Resource: Psionic Naruto Builds
A project which translates Naruto-verse characters into halfway playable characters. If you look at the build for Hyuaga Neji, you'll notice that he performs a nova routine which does an average 254d6 damage at the expenditure of 15pp, modified by the occasional Nat1 and Nat20. I don't want that.
What I'll have for sure:
CORE 3.5, with the exception of all spellcasting. If somebody really wants a certain ability, I will create a psionic version wich they may use.
Psionic classes and rules with the exception of the Divine Mind.
Some material from the 'Mind's Eye' web articles.
Hyperconscious. A thrid party source book for psionic characters.
Frank and K's advanced combat rules from Races of War.
What I'll be tossing:
The entire wealth system and most of the magic item system. The characters get a standard set of 15 shurikens/needles, five daggers (kunai), a first aid kit, 30ft of wire, and a dozen fire tags each. This is on top of whatever gimmick equipment a player may request, and the stuff I'll just handout.
I'm out of ideas at this point. Help?
I had a signature here once but I've since lost it.
My current project: http://tgdmb.com/viewtopic.php?t=56456
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Judging__Eagle
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### Re: Ninja (geshtalt psion/rogue?) adventure

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Post by Judging__Eagle » Sun Mar 04, 2007 12:25 am

Except that the 254d6 Nejii Routine comes after a few rounds of consistant attacking with other high damage routines.
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the_taken
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### Re: Ninja (geshtalt psion/rogue?) adventure

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Post by the_taken » Sun Mar 04, 2007 8:51 pm

254d6 damage is allot of rolls. Although 899 damage is appropriate given the character that does it, it's insane.
Second, that's a lvl20 character. I'm thinking of having these players go from level 9 to 12. Or 13 to 16. Depends on what I can discern from this discussion.
I had a signature here once but I've since lost it.
My current project: http://tgdmb.com/viewtopic.php?t=56456
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Judging__Eagle
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### Re: Ninja (geshtalt psion/rogue?) adventure

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Post by Judging__Eagle » Sun Mar 04, 2007 9:13 pm

Well, check out the thread and see what that Nejii build can do at lvl 12?
The Gaming Den; where Mathematics are rigorously applied to Mythology.
While everyone's Philosophy is not in accord, that doesn't mean we're not on board.
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the_taken
  Knight-Baron
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### Re: Ninja (geshtalt psion/rogue?) adventure

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Post by the_taken » Sun Mar 04, 2007 10:07 pm

Feats:
Linked Power (1)
Psi crystal Affinity (Human)
Psi crystal Containment (Flaw)
Delay Power (3)
Expanded Knowledge (Dissipating Touch) (6)
Psionic Meditation (9)
Twin Power (12)
Powers:
1st - Dissipating Touch, Mighty Spring*, Skate
2nd - Body Equilibrium, Evade Attack*, Hustle
3rd - Danger Sense, Evade Burst, Mental Barrier, Touchsight, Ubiquitous Vision
65pp (assuming 18 INT)
Round one
Standard Action-> Feint
Round two
Swift Action-> Lurk augment: Power Drain and Stunning Attack + 8pp boost (DC 18)
Standard Action-> 10pp DT, average damage 40.5hp and 20.25pp, focus 1/2
Move Action-> Refocus, 2/2 focus
Round three 20.25 free pp this round
Swift Action-> Lurk augment: Power Drain and Stunning Attack + 8pp (DC 18)
Standard Action-> 12pp DT, average damage 52.5hp and 26.25pp, focus 1/2
Move Action-> Refocus, 2/2 focus
Round four 26.25 free pp this round
Swift Action-> Lurk augment: Power Drain and Stunning Attack + 12pp (DC 20)
Standard Action-> 12pp DT, average damage 52.5hp and 26.25pp, focus 1/2
Move Action-> Refocus, 2/2 focus
repeat Round four 'till you target runs out of hp or pp
18pp to unleash unlimited damage is still insane. DC 20 fort save is manageable though.
I had a signature here once but I've since lost it.
My current project: http://tgdmb.com/viewtopic.php?t=56456
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Judging__Eagle
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### Re: Ninja (geshtalt psion/rogue?) adventure

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Post by Judging__Eagle » Mon Mar 05, 2007 10:43 pm

So?
What else can it do?
It's likelooking at the Races of War Barbarian.
If it can do is survive attacks and deal melee damage as it's key features; and it's not stepping on anyone elses toes, who cares?
It's fulfilling it's class/build/character focus.
Nejii just does tons and tons of melee damage, right? At lvl 12 he still needs to fly to reach his opponents and he can't kill lots of guys at a time, can he?
He really just is able to start and sustain a powerful melee attack routine.
Is he tough enough to stand toe-to-toe with stuff like a pair giants, or a band of trolls or a horde of shadows?
He's got to be weak somewhere; saves, skills, AC, HP. When you find it you'll see what's either okay or wrong with the build.
Is he a melee-glass cannon? A damage machine with poor saves or no ability to do non-combat things?
Also, does it break any rules?
If it's not, then I'd say it's fair game.
The Gaming Den; where Mathematics are rigorously applied to Mythology.
While everyone's Philosophy is not in accord, that doesn't mean we're not on board.
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the_taken
  Knight-Baron
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### Re: Ninja (geshtalt psion/rogue?) adventure

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Post by the_taken » Tue Mar 06, 2007 10:06 pm

Abilities:
enough skill points for stealth and acrobatics, plus a few misc
high damage output with after two rounds
generally low fort, saves may vary depending apon player preference
HP will not be high, but there are a few attack negation powers (3)
detection buffs, Touchsight nerfs invisibility while Ubiquitous Vision nerfs flanking and buffs spot
Skate + Mighty Spring together grant a substantial bonus to jump checks, this build is fairly mobile
Damage output is acceptable, but I'm gonna keep an eye on the potential stun juggling
So I don't need to pull the level of power down if I pull the level of the game down. Thanks, Judds. You've been helpful.
I had a signature here once but I've since lost it.
My current project: http://tgdmb.com/viewtopic.php?t=56456
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Judging__Eagle
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### Re: Ninja (geshtalt psion/rogue?) adventure

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Post by Judging__Eagle » Wed Mar 07, 2007 8:36 am

Actually, I was nothing of the sort.
I was just asking you to relook at what you'll be using.
I'm glad it worked.
Also, how you said that Nejii was 'crazy' at lvl 20; well, that's true and it should be true.
In fact anything lvl 17+ is batshit insane.
Heck, even Frank admits that the game falls apart at that point; and everyone and their dog says he writes overpowered material, so he's at least not making false claims.
The Gaming Den; where Mathematics are rigorously applied to Mythology.
While everyone's Philosophy is not in accord, that doesn't mean we're not on board.
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the_taken
  Knight-Baron
  Posts: 830
  Joined: Fri Mar 07, 2008 7:54 pm
  Location: Lost in the Sea of Awesome

### Re: Ninja (geshtalt psion/rogue?) adventure

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Post by the_taken » Thu Mar 08, 2007 12:53 pm

Yes, you were helpful. I was looking for a big rule change, which would have taken hours out of my time, and probably given me a large headache.
You help me realize a simple solution. One that I was implementing anyway, but without adding anything complicated. I now have more free time, and no headache. You were helpful.
I had a signature here once but I've since lost it.
My current project: http://tgdmb.com/viewtopic.php?t=56456
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Judging__Eagle
  Prince
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  Joined: Fri Mar 07, 2008 7:54 pm
  Location: Lake Ontario is in my backyard; Canada

### Re: Ninja (geshtalt psion/rogue?) adventure

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Post by Judging__Eagle » Thu Mar 08, 2007 5:08 pm

I guess.
You pretty much summarised what the problem and solution was (they're crazy t lvl 20, but so is everything, so you brought down the levels, where they would be playing, and are thus les crazy).
I have actually done nothing except keep pushing you to make sure you weren't overlooking something since I was too busy at the time to look at the Nejii build again.
Anyway, it's still a crazy build; but it's really pretty vunerable to some stuff (arbitrary damage sources, some saves)
The Gaming Den; where Mathematics are rigorously applied to Mythology.
While everyone's Philosophy is not in accord, that doesn't mean we're not on board.
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the_taken
  Knight-Baron
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  Joined: Fri Mar 07, 2008 7:54 pm
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### Re: Ninja (geshtalt psion/rogue?) adventure

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Post by the_taken » Fri Mar 09, 2007 8:02 pm

Skills: Ninjas should be very skillful. But if you look at the psionic builds, you'll notice that most of the classes being used have a huge skill deficiency.
My first idea was to automatically gestalt every character with rogue. But then everybody gets sneak attack for free.
Then I considered expert, the NPC class, presetting stealth, athletics, acrobatics and detection as class skills.
I was at first satisfied, but this undermines the value of the few classes that grant additional skill points.
I'll just state: Add spot, listen, search, hide, move silently, tumble, jump, climb, swim, decipher script, disguise, bluff, sense motive, intimidate, diplomacy and forgery as class skills. Increase the number of skill points you get per level by 6 (24 at first).
Opinion?
I had a signature here once but I've since lost it.
My current project: http://tgdmb.com/viewtopic.php?t=56456
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