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Brobdingnagian
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### The Unborn

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Post by Brobdingnagian » Thu Jul 12, 2007 8:54 am

Anyone here ever played any of the Bloody Roar series of games? They're 3D fighting games, and they have a cool (if overused by now) concept; human fighters that can temporarily turn into a kind-of were-beast form to gain added power. Every character for the game had a certain concept.
There was Yugo, the Wolf. Main character hero-type. Long, the Tiger. Wise fighter-type. Shen-Long, the Tiger. Clone of wise fighter-type. Jenny, the Bat. Slut/whore/legs up to your neck. Stun, the Insect. Science experiment gone wrong. And a bunch of others.
In Bloody Roar three, one of the new characters introduced was Xion, the Unborn. As far as I can tell, his concept was god-mode. In his human form, he could keep up with everyone else in their beast form, and his beast form wasn't even a beast of some sort. It was this eight-foot pseudo-insectoid demon thing with blades, skin like armour, and a face in the middle of its chest.
Anyway, the Unborn that I'm making up here are not based off that in any fashion except for how it looks. Also, I'm not typing this up tonight. I'm exhausted and I want to go to bed. I just want the thread started so I remember to do it. I'll get on it tomorrow or something.
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Brobdingnagian
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### Re: The Unborn

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Post by Brobdingnagian » Thu Jul 12, 2007 7:02 pm

Okay, so here's the general idea. Fiends (demons, devils, yugoloths, damodreds, Richard Simmons) are somehow created. Maybe they're individually forged from the essence of souls on their plane, maybe they're brewed in industrial vats, maybe they spontaneously poof into existance, whatever. Logically, as with anything else, when creating a fiend, something can go wrong. It probably doesn't happen all that often, but since these are outsiders and there's therefore an infinite number of them, there's an infinite number being created at any given time. So there's always something going wrong.
The idea I have for these Unborn is this: what if, when the creation process for a fiend goes bad, the creature isn't outright destroyed by the mistake? What if, very rarely, the essence of that creature finds a way to survive? Say... by fusing to a newborn mortal host. That would be interesting, wouldn't it? Two minds, the mortal's and the fiend's, a single body but two seperate forms, and one soul so that they may never be seperated from each other. I think it'd be great for a game like D&D; everybody would think 'Ah! Demon!' and try to banish it or cast Holy Sword, and it wouldn't work and the DM would laugh.
The general concept I have for Unborn is, unfortunately, the concept of kicking ass and being totally sweet. So I'm going to list a few notes on concept and then a few notes on mechanics, and from there I'm looking for advice.
Number. Concept Notes.
Mechanical Translation.
1. The two entities of the Unborn can never be seperated by anything short of deific interference.
'Unborn' is an inherited template that can be applied to any living creature with an Intelligence score of 3 or higher, except for outsiders and elementals. The creatures type changes to Outsider and it gains the (Native) subtype. Its former type becomes a subtype; it is still considered this type for all purposes related to type. Do not recalculate HD, skills, or saves. Unborn are not vulnerable to spells and effects that specifically target outsiders; spells and effects that specifically target their previous type still affect them.
2. Unborn are not by nature evil. The alignment and rational disposition of the fiend part of the Unborn vary based upon the reasoning capabilities of the host; a very dumb host will likely have a less reasonable demon, while an exceedingly intelligent host will have a demon capable of high learning and thought. The two minds of the Unborn can either be agreeable or conflicting; it's different for each one. Err... two. Whatever. If the Unborn's minds are in agreement, they will usually refer to themselves and each other as 'we', making it difficult for an outside observer to understand exactly who's talking about who.
Dual personality. Mental scores are equal. Unborn gain a circumstance bonus on saving throws against mind-affecting affects because they have two minds to affect, making it harder. Or maybe they should each get a saving throw. I'm not sure. Also, if one tries to force control of the body from the other, they make opposed Charisma checks; the mind that the current body is related to gets a circumstance bonus on such effects.
3. The transformation from base form to fiend form is not painful, but it is exceptionally uncomfortable. The change is very obvious; the fiend form is always much larger and often has weapons coming from its skin. Due to this, most armour and clothing will simply be shredded or dislodged when transformation occurs, becoming useless for the duration of the fiend form. The transformation back to base form is noticeably more comfortable.
Transformation to fiend form takes a full-round action to occur. Transformation to human form takes a standard action. Fiend form is one size-category larger than the base form. Clothing is shredded, armour becomes non-funtional in fiend form. That was easy.
4. Unborn, due to the circumstances of their creation, are exceptionally difficult to kill when in fiend form. They have exceptionally tough skin, regenerate from any wound, and have no internal organs, centre of thought, or skeletal structure; rather, they are a single solid mass. In human form, they are only slightly harder to kill than most, due to an enhanced constitution.
Okay, the long one. Let's go with... DR X/magic, where X is twice the CR of the Unborn. NA Bonus of + huge... 8+CR? Maybe 6. Regeneration X, where X is 1/4 the total hit points of the Unborn. Unborn can regenerate lost limbs and head, but are paralysed as long as they don't have a head. Electricity deals normal damage to Unborn, but will not stop limbs from regrowing. Applying the template gives the base creature +6 Constitution. In fiend form it has a +8 size bonus to Strength and a +4 competence bonus to Dexterity.
5. The fiend part of the Unborn know how to fight, regardless of whether or not their host does.
Unborn always have full BAB, regardless of what HD or classes they have.
6. Unborn in fiend form always have glowing red eyes, no lips, and two rows of long, razor-sharp teeth, giving the look of a malicious grin. Unborn in human form always look thin and pale,to the point of being sickly, despite their natural endurance.
Unborn are fvcking scary. Unborn gain a bonus on Intimidate checks against members of their base race when in fiend form, but take a penalty when in base form.
So yeah. I'm going to need a lot of help cleaning this up and making it functional. Ideas?
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Brobdingnagian
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### Re: The Unborn

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Post by Brobdingnagian » Fri Jul 13, 2007 9:01 pm

Okay, so here's a sample of what I think we can do with this. I'll list a base creature stat-block first (2nd level human rogue) and I'll use the Elite Array, then I'll list the rules I've come up with so far for the template, then I'll apply the template and list the two seperate statblocks.
Base Creature:
Lucio, 2nd Level Human Rogue
Medium Humanoid (Human)
HD: 2d6+4 (11 hp)
Initiative: +2
Speed: 30 feet (6 squares)
Armor Class: 16 (+2 Dex, +3 mwk Studded Leather Armour, +1 mwk Buckler), touch 12, flat-footed 14
Base Attack/Grapple: +1/+1
Attack: Shortbow +3 ranged (1d6/x3) or Rapier +3 melee (1d6/18-20)
Full Attack: Same
Space/Reach: 5ft/5ft
Special Attacks: Sneak Attack +3d6
Special Qualities: Trapfinding, Evasion
Saves: Fort +2, Ref +5, Will +1 (-3 against Fear effects)
Abilities: STR 10, DEX 15, CON 14, INT 12, WIS 13, CHA 8
Skills: Balance +7, Climb +5, Decipher Script +6, Disable Device +6, Escape Artist +7, Hide +7, Listen +6, Move Silently +7, Search +6, Spot +6
Feats: Weapon Finesse, Kraven
CR: 2
Alignment: Neutral Good
Okay, so there's our base creature. Now here's our template.
Unborn
Flavour text describing Unborn
"Unborn" is an inherited template that can be added to any living, corporeal creature (with the exception of outsiders and elementals), hereafter referred to as the base creature.
An Unborn uses all the base creatures abilities and statistics except as noted below.
Size and Type: The creatures type changes to Outsider, and it gains the (Native) subtype. It retains its former type as a subtype. For all effects related to type, it is still considered a member of its base race and not an Outsider. In Fiend Form (see below), the base creature's size increases by one category.
Speed: All of the base creature's movement speeds are doubled when in Fiend Form. Depending on the variety of Unborn (see Fiend Class, below), it may gain or further improve movement modes in Fiend Form.
Armour Class: The base creature's Natural Armour increases equal to twice its HD in Fiend Form.
Attacks: The base creature gains two claws and a bite attack when in Fiend Form; use the tables for the Half-Fiend, pg. 148 of the Monster Manual. Depending on the variety of Unborn (see Fiend Class, below), it may also have Blade or Energy attacks in Fiend Form.
Special Qualities:
Mortal Form/Fiend Form: Unborn have two minds, a mortal and a fiend, and correspondingly have two bodies to match. While the mortal body looks pale and sickly, the fiend body is large and powerful. When Unborn change to Fiend Form, apply the following changes:
Increase size by one category.
Give claw and bite attacks.
Apply natural armour bonus.
Gain Darkvision 60ft, or increase existing Darkvision by 60ft.
Gain Low-Light Vision, or Superior Low-Light Vision if LLV is already posessed.
Gain a +4 racial bonus on Spot and Listen checks.
Apply all special qualities of appropriate variety of Unborn.
All clothing gets shredded. All armour becomes useless. Equipment is otherwise unaffected. When an Unborn returns to Mortal Form, armour requires a full-round action to reapply properly.
The transformation to Fiend Form takes a full-round action. The transformation to Mortal Form takes a standard action.
When in Fiend Form, Unborn gain a +8 size bonus to Strength, and a +4 competence bonus to Dexterity.
All Unborn also have a Fiend Class (see below) that grants abilities or alters normal abilities. See each one for details.
Demonic Dread: Unborn are both outcast and terrifying to members of their own race. When in mortal form, an Unborn looks pale and sickly, cause a -4 circumstance penalty on all Intimidate checks against the creature's base race. When in Fiend Form, they gain a +4 circumstance bonus against members of their base race.
Control Freak: Unborn have two seperate minds, and though they have the same mental ability scores, they don't always agree with each other. The alignment and attitude of the Fiend mind differ depending on the reasoning ability of the Mortal mind. Use the following table to determine the alignment of the Fiend mind.
Int 5 or less: Fiend mind is diametrically opposed to Mortal mind.
Int 6-8: Fiend mind is two steps alignment steps away from Mortal mind on one axis, and one step away on the other.
Int 9-11: Fiend mind is one alignment step away from Mortal mind on each axis.
Int 12-14: Fiend mind is one alignment step away from Mortal mind on one axis.
Int 15+: Fiend mind is agreeable with Mortal mind.
Usually, each mind is control of their respective bodies; however, sometimes a mind may wish to control the other's body. In such a case, opposed Charisma checks are required. The mind that the current body is related to gains a +4 bonus on this check. This check must be repeated every minute the innappropriate mind remains in control. If one mind agrees to let the body be handled by the other, of course, this is entirely unnecessary.
This also means that Unborn are difficult to affect with mind-affecting effects. Unborn gain two saving throws against such effects; if one is unaffected, they are both unaffected. If the effect does not allow for a saving throw, this ability is void.
Organ-Free: Unborn in Fiend Form have no internal organs or bones. They do not need to breathe, but they must still eat and sleep. Unborn are still subject to extra damage from critical hits, as well as precision damage such as sneak attack, sudden strike, etc.
Regeneration: When in Fiend Form, Unborn gain Regeneration X, where X is equal to one-fifth the base creature's total hit points. Unborn will regenerate lost limbs and even their head in 4d4+6 rounds. Unborn can also reattach a limb or head by holding (or someone else holding) the severed member to the stump; such an act requires a move-equivalent action, and the member reattaches instantly. Unborn without a head are paralysed until it is reattached or regrows. Electricity deals normal damage to Unborn, but will not stop severed appendages from regrowing.
Damage Reduction: When in Fiend Form, Unborn gain Damage Reduction X/magic, where X is equal to the twice the CR of the Unborn.
Fiend Class: Each Unborn is different, in part because of their hosts, and in part because of themselves. Each one has a certain Fiend Class that grants them different abilities in Fiend Form.
Warrior Unborn: Warrior Unborn are considered the 'basic' class of Unborn, and are best suited towards melee combat.
Blades: In Fiend form, the Unborn has long spikes coming from each wrist. These Blades can deal piercing or slashing damage and deal damage equal to 1.5x the Unborn's Strength modifier. The damage dice for these Blades are listed below, depending on the size of the Unborn.
Diminutive: 1d3
Tiny: 1d4
Small: 1d6
Medium: 1d8
Large: 2d6
Huge: 3d6
Gargantuan: 4d6
Colossal: 5d6
A Blade attack is considered a weapon attack, and therefore cannot be used in conjunction with more than one natural attack during a full-attack action.
Spikes: In Fiend Form, the Unborn has spikes on its body used for grappling, which deal damage equal to one category smaller than their blade damage. These spikes can not be used outside of a grapple.
Born to Bleed (Ex): The Strength bonus in Fiend Form increases from +8 to +16, and the Dex bonus increases from +4 to +8. In either form, the Warrior Unborn always has full BAB, regardless of racial HD or class levels, and a +4 racial bonus on grapple checks.
Survivalist Unborn: Survivalist Unborn are even harder to kill than most Unborn, making even the weakest an annoying adversary.
I Live! (Ex): Increase Regeneration to 1/3 the Unborn's total hit points. Damage reduction changes from DR/magic to DR/-.
No Touchy! (Ex): The Unborn becomes immune to extra damage from critical hits and precision damage in Fiend Form.
Tough as Nails (Ex): In either form, the Survivalist Unborn always has good saving throws, regardless of racial HD or class levels, and has a +2 bonus to Constitution.
Mage Unborn: Mage Unborn do not use magic, but rather, have spell-like abilities granted through a sphere.
Energy Blast (Su): While in Fiend Form, a Mage Unborn may create a blast of energy to attack opponents. This blast is a ranged touch attack with a range of medium, and deals 1d6 + CHA mod damage per CR of the Unborn. This is usable at will.
Magic Time (Sp): Pick a fiendish sphere from the
[counturl=77]Tome of Fiends[/counturl]. The Mage Unborn now has Expert Access to that sphere in both forms, as well as a +6 to Charisma.
Squishy (Ex): Mage Unborn are not as physically powerful as other Unborn; their size bonuse to Strength in Fiend Form is only +2, and their increase to Constitution is only +4.
Skilled Unborn: Skilled Unborn are smaller than other Unborn, preferring to rely on stealth and guile to overcome obstacles.
I Do That (Ex): Skilled Unborn gain four extra skill points at first level, and one extra skill point each level afterward. This stacks with the similar human ability.
Skilled Unborn gain a bonus feat at first level and every four levels.
Sneaky (Ex): Skilled Unborn gain +2d6 to any sneak attack, sudden strike, or skirmish damage.
You Can't See Me (Ex): In Fiend Form, a Skilled Unborn's skin changes texture to reflect its surroundings and it has a natural grace, granting a +4 racial bonus to hide and move silently checks. They also gain a +8 bonus to Dexterity instead of the usual +4.
Not So Big (Ex):Skilled Unborn, unlike other Unborn, do not increase their size in Fiend Form. They no longer gain a size bonus to Strength; instead, they gain a +4 competence bonus to Strength.
Travelling Unborn: The Travelling Unborn are a frightening thought, mostly because they can pop up anywhere.
Anywhere You Can Go... (Ex): In Fiend Form, a Travelling Unborn has all the following movement modes available to them: land speed, flying, swimming, climbing, and burrowing. Increase the base creature's fastest movement method as normal; this becomes the movement speed for all modes of movement in Fiend Form.
Jay-ump! (Su): Three times per day in either form, a Travelling Unborn may use Dimension Door with a caster level equal to its CR.
Ultimate Unborn: Truly the most frightening of abominations, the Ultimate Unborn gains all the best aspects of the other classes while having no flaws.
Ultimate Unborn have the following abilities of other Fiend Classes:
Blades
Spikes
Born to Bleed
I Live!
No Touchy!
Tough as Nails
Energy Blast
Magic Time
I Do That
Sneaky
You Can't See Me
Anywere You Can Go...
Jay-ump!
Ability Scores: Unborn gain a +6 to Constitution and a +2 to Charisma, regardless of form. The specific Fiend Class for each Unborn may alter this.
--------------------------------------------------------------
Hmm... I didn't think there'd be that much to it. Oh well. I'll start a new reply to apply the Warrior Unborn template to little Lucio up there.
EDIT!
Remembered the base ability score adjustments.
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Brobdingnagian
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### Re: The Unborn

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Post by Brobdingnagian » Fri Jul 13, 2007 9:51 pm

Okay, so now we're going to apply the Warrior Unborn template to Lucio, our second level human rogue. First, his Mortal Form stat block.
Lucio, 2nd Level Warrior Unborn Rogue
Medium Outsider (Native, Humanoid, Human)
HD: 2d6+10 (17 hp)
Initiative: +2
Speed: 30 feet (6 squares)
Armor Class: 16 (+2 Dex, +3 mwk Studded Leather Armour, +1 mwk Buckler), touch 12, flat-footed 14
Base Attack/Grapple: +2/+6
Attack: Shortbow +4 ranged (1d6/x3) or Rapier +4 melee (1d6/18-20)
Full Attack: Same
Space/Reach: 5ft/5ft
Special Attacks: Sneak Attack +3d6
Special Qualities: Trapfinding, Evasion, Fiend Form, Control Freak, Demonic Dread
Saves: Fort +5, Ref +5, Will +1 (-3 against Fear effects)
Abilities: STR 10, DEX 15, CON 20, INT 12, WIS 13, CHA 10
Skills: Balance +7, Climb +5, Decipher Script +6, Disable Device +6, Escape Artist +7, Hide +7, Intimidate +0 (-4 against Humans), Listen +6, Move Silently +7, Search +6, Spot +6
Feats: Weapon Finesse, Kraven
CR: ?
Alignment: Neutral Good
Trapfinding: pg. 50 of the Player's Handbook.
Evasion (Ex): pg. 50 of the Player's Handbook.
Fiend Form (Su): As a full-round action, Lucio can let his other mind, Neox, take control, and turn into a powerful fiend.
Control Freak (Ex): Lucio is rational enough that Neox doesn't adamantly oppose him. Though Lucio will attempt to go out of his way to assist others, Neox is concerned primarily with their continued survival, and will not try to take command of the body unless Lucio does something extremely dangerous. If Neox attempts to take control of the body, he must make an opposed Charisma check with Lucio. Lucio gains a +4 circumstance bonus on this check. If Neox succeeds, this check must be repeated every minute.
Any mind-affecting effect that targets Lucio and allows a saving throw automatically entitles Lucio to a second saving throw if the first failed.
Demonic Dread (Ex): Lucio, despite his good health, appears pale and sickly, and is not well-respected by other members of his race. He takes a -4 penalty on Intimidate checks against humans.
Born to Bleed (Ex): Lucio always has a base attack bonus equal to his hit dice, regardless of his classes, and a +4 racial bonus on grapple checks.
Well now, that's not too much different. Slightly better attack and grapple, few more hit points, lower intimidate checks, harder to brainwash... now let's do the stat-block for his alter-ego. We'll call him Neox.
Neox, 2nd Level Warrior Unborn Rogue
Large Outsider (Native, Humanoid, Human)
HD: 2d6+10 (17 hp)
Initiative: +6
Speed: 60 feet (6 squares)
Armor Class: 21 (+6 Dex, +4 natural, +1 mwk Buckler), touch 16, flat-footed 15
Base Attack/Grapple: +2/+10
Attack: Shortbow +8 ranged (1d6/x3) or Rapier +10 melee (1d6+8/18-20) or Blade +10 melee (2d6+12/x2) or claw +10 melee (1d6+8/x2) or bite +10 melee (1d8+12/x2)
Full Attack: Shortbow +8 ranged (1d6/x3) or Rapier +10 melee (1d6+8/18-20) or Blade +10 melee (2d6+12/x2) and bite +5 melee (1d8+4/x2) or 2 claws +10 melee (1d6+8/x2) and bite +5 melee (1d8+4/x2)
Space/Reach: 10ft/10ft
Special Attacks: Sneak Attack +3d6, Blades, Spikes
Special Qualities: Trapfinding, Evasion, Darvision 60ft., Low-Light Vision, Mortal Form, Control Freak, Demonic Dread, Organ-Free, Born to Bleed, DR ?/magic, regeneration 3
Saves: Fort +5, Ref +9, Will +1 (-3 against Fear effects)
Abilities: STR 26, DEX 23, CON 20, INT 12, WIS 13, CHA 10
Skills: Balance +11, Climb +13, Decipher Script +6, Disable Device +6, Escape Artist +11, Hide +7, Intimidate +0 (+4 vs. Humans), Listen +10, Move Silently +11, Search +6, Spot +10
Feats: Weapon Finesse, Kraven
CR: ?
Alignment: Neutral
Trapfinding: pg. 50 of the Player's Handbook.
Evasion: pg. 50 of the Player's Handbook.
Mortal Form: Neox can, as a standard action, let his other mind, Lucio, take control and assume human form.
Control Freak (Ex): Lucio gladly allows Neox to do the fighting, but is opposed to excessive brutality and will attempt to stop Neox if he gets carried away. If Lucio attempts to take control of the body from Neox, opposed Charisma checks are required. Neox gains a +4 bonus on this check. If Lucio gains control, another check is required every minute to sustain it.
Any mind-affecting effect that targets Neox and allows a saving throw automatically entitles Neox to a second saving throw if the first failed.
Demonic Dread (Ex): Being a monster and human, Neox has the appearance to frighten others and the insight into human minds to make them compliant. Neox gains a +4 bonus to Intimidate checks against humans.
Organ-Free: Neox has no internal organs or bone structure, and as such does not need to breathe. He must still eat and sleep, and is still subject to extra damage from critical hits and precision damage.
Regeneration: Electricity deals normal damage to Neox. Neox will regenerate lost limbs and even his head in 4d4+6 rounds. Neox can also reattach a limb or head by holding (or someone else holding) the severed member to the stump; such an act requires a move-equivalent action, and the member reattaches instantly. If Neox's head is removed, he is paralysed until it is reattached or regrows. Electricity will not stop severed appendages from regrowing.
Blades: Neox has a single blade protruding from each wrist. These Blades deal 2d6 + 12 of either piercing or slashing damage.
Spikes: Neox's body is covered in spikes. Upon a successful grapple check, these spikes deal 1d8 + 4 points of piercing damage automatically.
Born to Bleed (Ex): Neox always has a base attack bonus equal to his hit dice, regardless of his classes, and a +4 racial bonus on grapple checks.
------------------------------
Boy does he ever seem a lot stronger now. So, here's where I need help. I need to know just what CR these guys should be. With the exception of the Ultimate Unborn, they're all about equal, so I figure that last one should be 2 higher than the rest. Give me some feedback, here.
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Brobdingnagian
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### Re: The Unborn

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Post by Brobdingnagian » Sat Jul 14, 2007 7:25 am

Okay, you know what? This isn't going to work. At least, not like this. I'll get to work on assigning abilities according to HD later. I can make this work... somehow.
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Rob_Knotts
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### Re: The Unborn

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Post by Rob_Knotts » Sat Jul 14, 2007 3:43 pm

> Brobdingnagian at [unixtime wrote:1184230474[/unixtime]]There was Yugo, the Wolf. Main character hero-type. Long, the Tiger. Wise fighter-type. Shen-Long, the Tiger. Clone of wise fighter-type. Jenny, the Bat. Slut/whore/legs up to your neck. Stun, the Insect. Science experiment gone wrong. And a bunch of others.

Jut a comment on Xion as a PC concept. In Japanese games/comics/animation it seems to be traditional for settings where the superhero is fighting his own origin (Guyver, Devilman, just to name a couple) that the ultimate enemy also be the ultimate result (most succesful experiment, most powerful supernatural incarnation) of the blasphemous origin for the hero. Characters like Xion usually don't act as central protagonists in a story (at least not in thier most powerful form), because thier full revelation usually marks the final battle of the story.
PS: You might find this website interesting, especially the Bloody Roar section:
The Fighter's Generation
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Catharz
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### Re: The Unborn

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Post by Catharz » Mon Jul 16, 2007 3:30 am

This may sound like a dumb idea, but I'd make it a RoW-style feat rather than a template. Have it cover only the mental/shapechanging aspects, and give it the following caveat: The character can choose to 'express' or 'hide' the effects of any Fiendish feats as a full-round action, or when transforming into demonic form. And it makes the character count as an outsider from a specific plane and as a native of the material planes.
Then they take levels in Fiendish Brute, True Fiend, or Conduit if they want to embrace other aspects of their fiendish nature.
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JonSetanta
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### Re: The Unborn

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Post by JonSetanta » Tue Jul 24, 2007 1:53 am

Here's my advice for the template:
Don't do pseudo-classses, have it modular.
The process for making an Unborn character would be thus:
1 add template
2 select from a single list of 'Unborn feats' or Tome of Fiends stuff; this includes body enhancements, SLAs, Spheres, attack modes, resistances, etc... no need to limit by "warrior" or "mage" and so on
3 select from a pool of stat bonuses to add when in Fiend form, and Mortal form gets CON+2
4 select appearance, based on all features added
Actually I assumed this thread would be about fetuses or something, but was pleasantly surprized.
Maybe you shouldn't call it "Unborn"... what was the Bloody Roar lycan type called... Zoans?
How about Demonothropes? haha

> The Adventurer's Almanac wrote: ↑
> Fri Oct 01, 2021 10:25 pm
> Nobody gives a flying fuck about Tordek and Regdar.

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Brobdingnagian
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### Re: The Unborn

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Post by Brobdingnagian » Wed Jul 25, 2007 7:16 am

I was kind of thinking of making it a sort of gestalt-class as a template thing. You'd start off as a level 1 whatever-base-class and a level 1 Unborn, and get basic abilities. Say, increased STR in fiend form and fast healing in fiend form, maybe. And I agree that you shouldn't be limited by a specific concept.
As you progressed in this class (meaning, as your character gained levels and your fiend side gained paralell power), you'd pick from a list of level-appropriate special abilities, as well as gain certain 'stock' enhancements that all Unborn would get. Such as, increased CON and CHA, fast healing progression, natural armour and damage reduction, whatever. The special abilities gained would be stuff similar to the special abilities I put in those fiend classes. Let's say... a special ability every 2 levels.
So, maybe you want to be hard to kill? You pick up a level 2 special ability that gives you good save progression all-around (let's call it Tough as Nails). At level 4 you get another ability, but this ability is of the same general use as your level 2 selection. In order to make sure nobody has The Edge on you, you pick up an ability that always gives you full BAB (Born to Bleed).
Since these abilities would be self-scaling, the only need to make certain abilities unavailable at a certain level is because they'd be too powerful. How to make them self-scaling for as long as you have your character, and yet inappropriate at earlier levels? Well... ability prerequisites.
Let's assume the above example. Now at level 6, you get access to Tier 2 abilities, or whatever. You could either take another Tier 1 ability, say, one that grants you Novice Access to a sphere, or a Tier 2 ability that you have the Tier 1 prerequisites for. So in order to get the Blades ability, you'd need Born to Bleed, and in order to get the immune-to-crits ability (No Touchy) you'd need Tough as Nails.
Hmm... okay, yeah, I can make this work. Although, I'm going to have to clear something up just in case it isn't obvious. Playing an Unborn character would be very similar to playing a gestalt character. If the whole group isn't doing it and you're not playing an over-powered game, it won't work. It can still be done as an NPC villain, but the CR of such a foe would be... finicky, to say the least.
I'll get to work on writing the actual stats later on. I'm tired.
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