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Username17
  Serious Badass
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Post by Username17 » Thu Apr 14, 2011 11:02 am

> mean_liar wrote:So... if he edits his shit all the time (clearly, obviously), then... apparently nothing got used anyway, since it got edited, yes?

Since Caedrus has not produced a finished product of any kind, the point would seem to be moot, yes. And since even if he did produce a finished product, he would be welcome to use as much of my writing as he wanted with or without attribution, there doesn't seem to be anything to get defensive about.
As far as I am concerned, the issue is 100% that Caedrus flipped out over this non-issue, and 0% the actual issue itself. Because it's a non-issue. It's seriously a question of whether Caedrus considered using open source materials in a piece of vaporware. But he apparently wants to turn that into a finger pointing game, and I don't actually back down to internet toughguy yelling. Ever.
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RobbyPants
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Post by RobbyPants » Thu Apr 14, 2011 1:04 pm

> Aryxbez wrote: EDIT: Oh, and why haven't we all banded together to make the next super awesome edition/Fantasy RPG, that blows away all the crap RPG developers out there yet?

It's been tried (TNE). It's kind of a too many cooks in the kitchen, or death by committee scenario. Not everyone agrees on what direction to take.
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Midnight_v
  Knight-Baron
  Posts: 629
  Joined: Thu May 15, 2008 10:27 pm
  Location: Texas

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Post by Midnight_v » Thu Apr 14, 2011 1:30 pm

I caedrus the same person as Onewinged4ngel?
Don't hate the world you see, create the world you want....

> Dear Midnight, you have actually made me sad. I took a day off of posting yesterday because of actual sadness you made me feel in my heart for you.

...If only you'd have stopped forever...
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Leress
  Prince
  Posts: 2767
  Joined: Fri Mar 07, 2008 7:54 pm

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Post by Leress » Thu Apr 14, 2011 2:19 pm

> Midnight_v wrote:I caedrus the same person as Onewinged4ngel?

Yes.

> Koumei wrote:I'm just glad that Jill Stein stayed true to her homeopathic principles by trying to win with .2% of the vote. She just hasn't diluted it enough!

> Koumei wrote:I am disappointed in Santorum: he should carry his dead election campaign to term!

> Just a heads up... Your post is pregnant... When you miss that many periods it's just a given.

> I want him to tongue-punch my box.

]

> The divine in me says the divine in you should go fuck itself.

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RobbyPants
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Post by RobbyPants » Thu Apr 14, 2011 3:07 pm

> Leress wrote:

> > Midnight_v wrote:I caedrus the same person as Onewinged4ngel?

> Yes.

Yes, but only on this board. I think there's someone named Caedrus on BG who is someone entirely different. Every other board I've seen him on, he goes by Onewinged4ngel.
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Caedrus
  Knight-Baron
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  Joined: Fri Mar 07, 2008 7:54 pm

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Post by Caedrus » Thu Apr 21, 2011 10:12 pm

> Almaz wrote:

> > Aryxbez wrote:So, why is it so hard for Frank to merely just point out evidence to prove himself right/wrong, and Caedrus right/wrong? As it seems to me, Frank is just saying he refuses to provide evidence because: " I'm always right, and have people to back me up all religiously like, regardless if they understand the situation or not."

> If that is the case, seems a bit immature to me, just point out the evidence to support what you say, and if you turn out wrong, oh well, learn to change your position.
> Starting to sound like childish pride to me, if Caedrus is right/wrong, I and others who cared enough to continue the conversation would probably like to see some facts!

I really don't know what more evidence I can provide beyond what I posted for Robby's benefit earlier on this thread (if you haven't looked at that, then do), save actually going out and bugging *more* of the old members to get on and verify my claim, and frankly I'm not willing to waste their time on this old nonsense.
But you know, every single participant witness on the Okay Your Turn forums has just been written off as Biased because... why? I'm not exactly sure. Apparently the idea is that I have some kind of cult following of sycophants Frank does? That'd be news to me, lol.
Meanwhile, Frank just keeps throwing down insults and allegations, without even producing the least bit of evidence. He can't even be bothered to make a complete claim. He won't even tell you what essay was supposedly "copied."

> Because Caedrus can declare any evidence that Frank provides as fabricated

But he hasn't provided any. Not one thing. At all...
Not only will he not provide evidence, he won't even make a complete ALLEGATION. He won't even say what was supposedly copied.

> Caedrus' material was on a secret password only forum that he has administrative command over.

It was a password only sub-forum of Monte Cooke's "Okay, Your Turn" forum, and was ultimately administrated by Silver Dragon / Soren Staun.
Apparently, Frank's outlandish story that he would have you believe that I went through some herculean subversive effort to hide any signs of evidence that some (unnamed) essay of his was copied wholly and verbatim into the course of discussion, removed entirely without any trace or notice in the surrounding discussion, and doctor the administrative logs and such of a site that I don't even own, all because of his "non-accusation."
Hell, Occam's Razor should suffice.

> Because honestly I didn't think it was a big deal, and still didn't until Cadrus started BAWWING when I mentioned the event in an off-hand statement several months later.

...You know, all anyone has to do is read the stuff you wrote to see that it's not an off hand statement. You've been calling me all kinds of names in just this thread alone. All the "bawwing" I've done is pointing out that what you're saying simply is not a matter of fact.

> Checking right now is impossible, because Caedrus can and has changed the passwords several times.

Man, you just love making up random bullshit, don't you? That's not even how the site worked. You made up your own password. I just gave account permissions... people provided their own passwords.
Nevermind that you make it sound like this is still going on. The site went public forever ago. And then moved to a wiki format. And then the project ended.
In absolutely none of these formats was there ever any sign of influence from your work, let alone someone going around claiming your ideas were theirs.

> [*] I looked at it and confirmed that it was writing I had written, and took the principled stand that ideas should be free to copy whichever which way you want, and elected to do absolutely nothing.

If that were true, we wouldn't be having this conversation right now. You've been going on and on about this for months and months now. Long after the site became a public wiki, long after the project was finished. Long after the site was taken down, a friend links me here pointing out that all this time later, you are still constantly ranting that I, a guy whose life revolves around producing original creative content, am a guy who only claims credit for your work, even though obviously *nothing I've ever produced even shows a little bit of influence from your crap.*

> [*] Months later, I mentioned the incidence, and Caedrus flipped the fuck out.

You know, it doesn't seem so hard for other people here to understand why being falsely accused of using your work might bother someone.

> [*] Caedrus attempted to "prove me wrong" by walking various people through prepared sections of his secret forum like a North Korean tour guide showing visitors how everything was fine.

Oh yeah, because everyone's going through so much effort just to secretly steal credit for your stuff so he can get all the glory on... a site that wasn't even available to the public? Hmm. Yes, your story makes so much sense.

> [*] Caedrus announced that he had been totally vindicated by the UN weapons inspectors - even though the person in question piped up that he hadn't actually visited it yet and hadn't made any determination at all.[/list]

As Bigode and a couple others have pointed out, this is a complete lie. Leress said that the claim was shown to be false, as did others.

> That's right, he is insisting that he has proof that his password-hidden, redacted material did not contain the things I say I saw back when I saw them. That is seriously what he is claiming.

I said there was evidence in my favor, not absolute proof, because absolute proof is a fantasy. Also, burden of proof always rests on the claimant.
Edited either because quotes broke the forum, or because of some super secret pointless conspiracy to inflate Frank's ego.
Last edited by Caedrus on Thu Apr 21, 2011 10:14 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Kaelik
  ArchDemon of Rage
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Post by Kaelik » Thu Apr 21, 2011 10:18 pm

1) Fix your tags.
2) You are retarded. You just spent every fucking paragraph of that post claiming Frank accused you of taking credit for his work, even though he never fucking did that. At least if you are going to whine the whole time, whine about what Frank actually said.
Last edited by Kaelik on Thu Apr 21, 2011 10:18 pm, edited 1 time in total.

> DSMatticus wrote:Kaelik gonna kaelik. Whatcha gonna do?

The U.S. isn't a democracy and if you think it is, you are a rube.
That's libertarians for you - anarchists who want police protection from their slaves.
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Caedrus
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Post by Caedrus » Fri Apr 22, 2011 8:21 am

> Kaelik wrote: 2) You are retarded. You just spent every fucking paragraph of that post claiming Frank accused you of taking credit for his work, even though he never fucking did that.

Somebody has a short memory.

> FrankTrollman wrote: His is/was an attempt to make a fully formed D&D game that would be an alternate 4th edition that was based more solidly on the concepts of earlier editions. He used a bunch of material from K and myself without attribution

Got any more wholly fabricated lies alongside blind insults? That seems to be pretty much your schtick after all.
Last edited by Caedrus on Fri Apr 22, 2011 8:24 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Starmaker
  Duke
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Post by Starmaker » Fri Apr 22, 2011 12:23 pm

> Caedrus wrote:

> > Kaelik wrote: 2) You are retarded. You just spent every fucking paragraph of that post claiming Frank accused you of taking credit for his work, even though he never fucking did that.

> Somebody has a short memory.

> > FrankTrollman wrote:His is/was an attempt to make a fully formed D&D game that would be an alternate 4th edition that was based more solidly on the concepts of earlier editions. He used a bunch of material from K and myself without attribution

> Got any more wholly fabricated lies alongside blind insults? That seems to be pretty much your schtick after all.

> Caedrus wrote: In absolutely none of these formats was there ever any sign of influence from your work, let alone someone going around claiming your ideas were theirs.
> (...)
> Long after the site was taken down, a friend links me here pointing out that all this time later, you are still constantly ranting that I, a guy whose life revolves around producing original creative content, am a guy who only claims credit for your work, even though obviously *nothing I've ever produced even shows a little bit of influence from your crap.*
> (...)
> Oh yeah, because everyone's going through so much effort just to secretly steal credit for your stuff so he can get all the glory on... a site that wasn't even available to the public?
> (...)
> Also, burden of proof always rests on the claimant.

And it just happens that in this post, 1 edit (which was hopefully fixing tags and only that), you claim Frank accused you of taking credit for his work.
Which he never did. All of Frank's posts in this thread are unedited.
Frank:
(1) stated that his work has been posted without attribution - which is not the same as taking credit; if I were to post Longcat I wouldn't claim credit for taking the photo or being the cat's owner
(2) accused you of behaving like a dumbfuck:

> FrankTrollman wrote:As far as I am concerned, the issue is 100% that Caedrus flipped out over this non-issue

So help yourself to a barrel.
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Caedrus
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Post by Caedrus » Fri Apr 22, 2011 8:18 pm

Is this guy for real?
1) The original claim, from Frank's "whistleblower" that he unquestioningly believed, then refused to back down when it turned out that Ubernoob was lying because Frank never admits being wrong:

> Leress wrote:

> > ubernoob wrote:Back while I was on the project I noticed a few of Frank's essays from the TNE threads used verbatim to start discussions with the implication that they were OW4's words (no citation or reference to seeing them elsewhere at all). The squares discussion in particular had Frank's stuff word for word.

> This has been shown to be false. I have look at the thread that this supposedly happened and there was no instance of that happening. Either it was a quote or it was a similar idea but also with other things as well. These changes were made before your departure.

That last bit, by the way, means that the posts in question were not edited in response to Frank (Another baseless fabrication, and one easily disproved. But now his idea is that I can magically change edit dates on Okay Your Turn. For all you guys claim to be saner than other forums out there, you sure are quick to cling to unfalsifiable belief systems).
2) Why anyone could possibly think it would be relevant to me whether Frank thinks spreading an outright lie about me on a wholly continuous basis over the course of months or years is a non-issue attests to the sycophantic following he has on this board. A slanderer saying he doesn't mind that he slandered you is like a thief saying he doesn't mind that he robbed you, and guess what, going around falsely advertising that someone (especially a private citizen) didn't produce their own IP is actually libel. In saner circles, pointing out that a statement like that is false is not seen as "flipping out." However, the kind of language I'm seeing used on the other side here definitely is.
Most people don't like being lied about, and I never posted anything of Frank's, or anyone else, without attribution. This is a simple fact, and for all that he "doesn't care" it seems odd that I come back here a year later and the first thing I see is that he's still ranting about it. And apparently other people, too.

> Bigode wrote:I hate JaronK as much as the next guy, but Frank is outright lying

Last edited by Caedrus on Fri Apr 22, 2011 8:25 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Orion
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Post by Orion » Fri Apr 22, 2011 9:17 pm

Caedrus,
that you were claiming Frank's work as your own was Ubernoob's interpretation. Frank isn't currently claiming that you did (I can't be arsed to go back and see what was said in the past.) He's saying that he went on the board, saw his essays, and they were not attributed.
Not attributed /= taking credit
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Kaelik
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Post by Kaelik » Fri Apr 22, 2011 9:43 pm

And then you quoted bioged who is also wrong. Because Frank rightly pointed out that a thing with foil action a lunge and the ability to come up with a feet for free has his work, and everyone admits it has his work, and Biogde wants to pretend that even though that fighter is the one posted in the thread, and the one everyone is talking about, and the one Frank linked to, that really Frank is talking about some other fighter not in that thread.
Literally the only way Biogde could be right is if you admitted to editing a post on that forum without it showing as edited, and you having lied to JaronK for two pages.

> DSMatticus wrote:Kaelik gonna kaelik. Whatcha gonna do?

The U.S. isn't a democracy and if you think it is, you are a rube.
That's libertarians for you - anarchists who want police protection from their slaves.
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Caedrus
  Knight-Baron
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  Joined: Fri Mar 07, 2008 7:54 pm

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Post by Caedrus » Fri Apr 22, 2011 10:33 pm

> Orion wrote:(I can't be arsed to go back and see what was said in the past.)

Well, I can remember what he said, so... :-\

> Orion wrote:He's saying that he went on the board, saw his essays, and they were not attributed.

And that's a false statement too. Regardless of how you choose to interpret him, he's still not telling the truth.
Last edited by Caedrus on Fri Apr 22, 2011 10:40 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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