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## The Planes: Not Just Alternate Primes (fuck you Planescape)

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squirrelloid
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### The Planes: Not Just Alternate Primes (fuck you Planescape)

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Post by squirrelloid » Fri Mar 22, 2013 5:59 pm

Sometime in 2nd edition AD+D, certainly no later than Planescape, the writers at TSR totally screwed how the planes worked. They forgot that there was an actual logic behind how planes related to each other. Then 3e came along, forgot even more, and so now we have legacy crap strewn all over the place that doesn’t make any sense. We need to fix this.
But what fix? We could go through and spot-change the legacy nonsense so it makes sense (although there’d likely be some forced profound changes here). We could go back to the original planar arrangement. We could do something totally different and write something else that makes sense.
Part of the problem with the rearrangement of the planes that started with Planescape is that it made the planes into more regular realms with regular joes who also happened to have alignment predispositions, but could get together and share a pint in Sigil. We don’t need or want this from the inner or outer planes. Seriously. There could be demi-planes or alternate primes where stuff that looks like demons and angels fight a millennial war and it wouldn’t even be weird. The planes: outer, inner, astral, and ethereal; these need to be alien places where different laws apply because that allows different kinds of storytelling and bespeaks of wonders beyond what’s available in the mortal realms. These aren’t just more prime material plane with slightly wacky physics that happen to glow when you cast the right alignment detection spell. These are alien realms with strange rules and creatures of unfathomable motivations.
And in case there's any question, the problem really was Planescape.

> wikipedia wrote:He (David Cook) also felt that Sigil came about because it was natural, because the planes needed a crossroads, and that the campaign needs a center which could be both a place for adventure and a place to hide, where characters could get to and from it quickly. Cook decided to adapt the Manual of the Planes, because the older material made survival on the planes too difficult or complex; he ignored anything that complicated gameplay, which left the "descriptions of twisted and strange creations".

The Planes had crossroads. They were the prime material planes. And all that stuff which made adventuring in the planes difficult is what made them interesting. It would be like deciding you don't need to worry about water or sandstorms in a desert because it makes survival too complex. Fuck that shit, fuck Planescape, and fuck David Cook. The best way to make the planes boring and meaningless is to make them more-or-less just like everywhere else.
Ahem.
So by preference then we should want something closer to the 1st and early 2nd edition visions of the planes. On the one hand, this is not going to be equally fair to all PCs - that’s okay, these alien realms are places you choose to go and can prepare for. The general rule of thumb should be that the inner and outer planes should not just be somewhere which could easily be replicated by an alternate prime. At the same time, we’re trying to stick close enough to the source material that we don’t need to rewrite the monster manual or do anything else terribly drastic. While writing a new planar cosmology from whole cloth could be done (and would be a worthy project), it's not the endeavor here.
The Basics
We’re primarily concerning ourselves with the major non-duplicable planes. Demi-planes are mostly duplicable. Prime Material planes are arbitrarily duplicable. Instead we’re concerned with two groups of planes: the material planes - the ethereal and the inner planes - and the conceptual planes - the astral and the outer planes.
Before we begin, a couple notes on the plane of shadow is warranted. Shadow is a series of planes each co-spatial with a particular prime. It borders no other planes, and has access to material and conceptual planes only through its prime. Creatures or material originating in inner or outer planes cannot enter, be called to, or manifest in a plane of shadow by any method, although shadowy fascimiles thereof may well exist in the plane or be created from shadowstuff.
Conceptual planes and material planes only meet in the prime material planes. The outer and astral planes have no access to the ethereal and inner planes and vice versa. What this means will be explained in greater detail in their own sections.
The Material Planes
First, an apology. Material planes might be kind of confusing with prime material plane. We should blame the phrase ‘prime material plane’, since it is neither prime (there’s an infinite number of them), nor uniquely material. However, the material planes (the inner and the ethereal) are uniquely material, and this really is the best description of them as a set. So deal with it.
The material planes are the source of matter. The d20 reality is based on greek concepts, including the elemental composition of matter. All matter is composed of some subset of Air, Earth, Fire, Water, and Aether. Negative and Positive energy are intrinsically tied to life and death.
(If you wish to treat this as commonly believed but ultimately lies, it implies weird things about the origin of the inner planes and their intimate connection to all the Primes, and the nature of undead and the connection of life to negative and positive energy. Perhaps the inner planes are the magical computronium which runs the primes or permits the magical manipulation of the primes, and was constructed by powerful wizards long ago to focus their art?)
The inner planes connect to the prime material plane predominantly through the ethereal, but portals can also connect directly from elemental to prime.
Aside: “Infinite” Planes with borders
This is going to come up basically all the time, and it’s stupid. But it’s also inherent to all our source material. If you like, you can treat them as very large but not infinite. Or at least not infinite in all directions. It’ll probably help you sleep better at night. This makes the geometry of the inner planes, for example, actually work as a real thing and not some crazy metaphor about networking. It also means they can have borders and we don’t need to cry about it, and lets you cross the plane of elemental water in finite time. However, for the traditionalists, we’re still going to refer to them as infinite, because that’s what our source material says. Meanwhile, we’re going to wish the original writers had taken at least one math course beyond algebra ever.
The Ethereal Plane
The ethereal plane exists in two separate modes. Border ethereal refers to the nature of the plane where it is co-spatial and co-planar with another plane. All planes which border the ethereal have a border ethereal co-spatial with them, even the inner planes.
At these locations the ethereal plane is like a smoky shadow of the plane co-spatial with it. Objects and persons have a ghostly existence, and can be seen, but not interacted with without some sort of magical ability that enables it. Similarly, the inhabitants of the adjoining plane can use magic to perceive creatures in the border ethereal.
The border ethereal obeys local gravity for the adjoining plane, and objects of sufficient size in the adjoining plane have a semi-real quality to the ‘shadow’ they cast into the ethereal. Creatures in the ethereal can not pass through an object unless they can be within 5’ of both the side entered and the side exited at the same time, as per the rules for ethereal creatures.
There was a bit here about the ethereal being the ether through which light traveled through, and legitimizing spelljammer, but my physicist friend ran away screaming in terror. (If you want to run with that, it’s on your head and i hope you don’t have physicist friends.)
One can move about the area of the adjoining plane via the border ethereal, or move in a fourth direction away from the border ethereal. As one leaves the realm of the border ethereal, the connection of the ghostly shadows cast into the ethereal by the adjoining plane becomes less connected with the current reality of that plane. Visions of things and events long since past might be seen. Eventually these semi-real shadows become obscure and indistinct before fading to a uniform misty foglike expanse.
Deep ethereal refers to the areas of the plane away from these border lands. Traveling through the deep ethereal is like traveling into a ghostly fog that extends to the limits of your perception in all directions. Gravity is defined by an act of will, and you may walk upon the ghostly fog at your feet or not as you choose. Vision is limited to 30’ in all directions.
Landmarks are exceedingly rare in the deep ethereal, and non-natives can easily become lost. A knowledge (the planes) check is required every few hours, and the base DC is 25 (for finding major destinations like the border ethereal to an inner plane) and go up from there depending on the obscurity of the location or feature.
In addition to the major planes, demi-planes exist embedded in the ethereal. Frequently, the border ethereal for demi-planes is exceedingly small, barely reaching past the region of co-spatiality. (A demi-plane is distinct from a full plane in that demi-planes are finite, whereas true planes are infinite in at least the three spatial directions.)
There may also be features within the ethereal itself. Ghostly images of things lost to time or occasionally the real things themselves. A fabled statue, a magic fountain, or a ghostly ship could all be encountered within the deep ethereal. Some of these objects may even exert some influence on the plane around them, shaping them to be suitable for the object. The magic fountain might be surrounded by a grove of trees - insubstantial ghost stuff or apparently real. This can approach the qualities of a demiplane, although these areas are exceeding small - hundreds of feet across at the most. Possibly they represent the genesis of new demiplanes before they become disjunct from the ethereal and their own plane.
The only ‘weather’, if it can be called that, in the deep ethereal is the ethereal vortex. It’s exact nature is left to the DM to decide, but what is known is that being engulfed by an ethereal vortex can propel creatures from the ethereal to the astral plane. This is the only known way to journey directly from the one to the other, although the trip is likely unpleasant and possibly lethal. Ethereal vortices are exceptionally rare.
The Inner Planes
Nothing groundbreaking here. The inner planes are much the same as they’ve always been. The four elemental planes about the equator of some imaginary sphere with positive and negative at the poles, except of course they’re each infinite planes.
Whether or not you like para-elemental and quasi-elemental planes is up to you. Nothing really requires they exist, or that if those ‘landscapes’ exist that they be separate planes. (The Manual of the Planes (2nd, where they first truly appeared) was somewhat confused on whether they were distinct planes in their own right or simply where the boundaries blurred). For the record, the para-elemental planes are Ooze, Magma, Smoke, and Ice. The quasi-elemental planes are Void, Salt, Dust, Ash, Lightning, Steam, Mineral, Radiance. (If you can’t figure out which goes where, google it).
Inner planes are constructed primarily of their element. That means the plane of Water is an endless ocean of elemental water, and the plane of Fire is an endless... sea?... of elemental fire. This state of affairs extends more or less indefinitely in any direction. Most of the plane is inhabited by nothing but elementals going about doing... whatever it is elementals do when not forced into servitude by wizards. Seriously, it’s boring, and we don’t care.
All the interesting stuff clusters around anomalies in the planes. Occasionally pockets of material from one plane makes it into another plane. Pockets in Earth are huge caverns and elaborate cave networks filled with the pocket material. Pockets in Water are floating islands of material - even fire is as possible as it is fantastic. (Elemental fire does not require fuel or oxygen and is not extinguished by water - treat it like a pocket of air except that it is fire, and the surrounding water is warmer than usual). Pockets in Air and Fire are much the same. Pockets may even contain multiple other elements, either by chance, or, more likely, by design. A pocket of air in the plane of fire may have had some elemental earth moved into it on which to build. A pocket may be any size from smaller than your hand to larger than a planet. Creatures other than elementals who are native to the inner planes tend to live in and around these anomalies, and some build cities in or on them.
Positive and Negative Energy do not form long-lasting pockets. They degrade elemental material they come in contact with. If using quasi-planes in any form, material touched by positive or negative energy behaves like a pocket of the appropriate quasi-plane.
If using para-or quasi-elemental planes, material from these planes can also form pocket material.
Navigating the inner planes may be easier or harder than navigating the deep ethereal, but certainly no easier than a DC 20 check on knowledge (the planes) for major features, made at the same frequency as voyaging through the ethereal. Just how easy or hard will depend on the prominence of the feature you are looking for, and how well you can perceive your surroundings in the plane. (For most PCs, air is the easiest to navigate and earth the hardest).
Sidebar: Movement in the inner planes
There is no up or down to the inner planes. Gravity is determined by will alone; direction and intensity can be specified as a swift action. Of course, players who cannot pass through rock will not be able to fall through the elemental plane of earth, and terminal velocity is dictated by the medium through which you’re falling. (Treat elemental fire approximately as air for determining terminal velocity). Terminal velocity in air is approximately 54 m/s, which means ~300 meters per round or near enough 900’ per round. (Treat water as 150’/r unless you really want to figure out the real answer). Please note this is the maximum speed of a fall, and you can choose a slower fall, at your option. More intricate movement than falling will require some appropriate movement mode.
Adventuring in the Material Planes
The primary feature of spellcasting in the material planes is that they have no access to the outer planes or the astral plane. Spells which require outer planes to function simply don’t. Summon Monster spells can only conjure elemental creatures. Spells which require access to outerplanar precepts like align weapon or bless water simply fail. Generally, any spell with an alignment subtype fails. (Note: spells which use negative energy are frequently tagged with [Evil]. We’ll fix this eventually, just keep in mind that negative energy is available in the inner planes). Spells which attempt to enter an outer plane or the astral plane similarly fail.
Similarly, the material planes have no access to the plane of shadow or dreams, and spells which require access to them fail. Note also that, while travelers in the material plane may rest, they do not dream.
Spells which summon planar creatures cannot summon a creature from the plane you are on. The magic calls creatures from another plane, not the same plane. (Natives of the prime material plane are immune to being called by summoning spells, so while the prime is accessible, you can’t summon creatures from it.) However, any inner plane is accessible from any other, so you can summon a water elemental to the plane of fire. (Possibly not the best idea, but you can do it).
Spells of the same subtype as the plane you are receive a +1 bonus to their caster level and deal an additional point of damage per die (or heal an additional point for healing spells cast on the positive energy plane). If you are using para- and quasi-elemental planes, count them as being both of the mixed planes for these purposes.
Planeshift can move creatures from a plane to the associated border ethereal (or vice versa). Only planes with a border ethereal can be traversed in this way. It can also move you from one elemental plane to another while near (within 10 miles per caster level) the border between the two - treat this as a group teleport except you don’t need to have seen the destination, and it places you up to 10 miles per caster level inside the other plane. The spell can only transport you to a plane co-spatial with or immediately bordering the one you’re on. (Exception: planeshift can facilitate immediate transport from one prime material plane to another).
Gate permits travel directly from the prime to any material plane, or between any two points on material planes. It does not permit travel from a material plane to a conceptual plane.
Spells which require communication with or the manifestation of the will of a deity automatically fail unless that deity is a native of the inner planes. Clerics without a specific deity are generally tied to the outerplanes as well, and so this restriction applies to them. (DM may permit some concepts to use the inner planes as their power source, but these philosophies are likely alien to prime material natives, and then remember that they won’t be able to access these spells in the outerplanes).
Most clerics will have lost direct contact with their deity, which will impede their ability to pray for spells. Clerics who do not worship inner planar (or ethereal) Powers slowly lose access to most of their spell list for their most powerful spell slots. However, the proximity of the negative and positive planes gives them some power. For every day a Cleric spends in the material planes, one of their highest level slots becomes restricted to spells which use positive or negative energy, until all their top three spell levels of slots are so restricted.
Note: the border ethereal is a special case in a lot of ways. It’s close enough to a prime material plane that some slop is allowed. Clerics may still contact their deities in the outer planes, and spells which utilize outer planar energies still function. However, calling creatures from the outer planes or the astral is still impossible - these creatures cannot exist within the ethereal, even the border ethereal, and will not answer the call.
All natives of the material planes are treated as neutral in alignment. Treat this as errata which supersedes any alignments published in WotC materials. In reality, they simply have no conception of the alignment system and their motivations are alien. (If you’ve read about the nature of the outer planes below, it’s entirely possible the inner planar natives have their own outer planes, but there’s no way for non-natives to enter it, and it may not bear any resemblance to the canonical outer planes).
Death in the Material Planes
Material plane natives who die simply revert to the matter of their plane. They cannot be raised by any means short of a Wish spell cast near the place of their death. (Miracle, of course, does not work in the material planes). Some of them, such as elementals, will simply reincarnate as new elementals. Jinn of all sorts are reborn as new Jinn of the same type. In all cases, memories of previous lives are lost. The fates of other creatures is up to the DM, although many may well not have souls at all and simply cease existing.
The souls of prime material natives who die in the material planes cannot pass on after death. They cannot find access to the outer planes and are trapped where they were slain. Magic such as raise dead can re-attach the soul to its body, so long as the spell is cast where the creature died. Otherwise the soul will merge with the plane over the period of a year and be reborn as an elemental. Elementals typically have no memory of their former lives. Once this happens, the elemental will need to be slain in order to restore the soul to life. In the ethereal plane, the souls of the slain instead become ghosts (and may well remember their former existence).
If a prime material native dies in the border ethereal of a prime material plane, there is a chance his soul can escape into the prime material and thus the outer planes. Should this fail, the spirit will become a ghost (as it would anywhere else in the ethereal).
The Conceptual Planes
Pop quiz: what does theosophy, Aleister Crowley, Professor X of the X-Men, and d20’s planar cosmology have in common? They all believe that the astral plane is a psychic realm where a a skilled practitioner can send his spirit to wander the world psychically. The X-Men reference is intentional - by the 60s, and continuing into the 70s, there was this popular ‘belief’ that the astral plane was a place where battles of the mind could be fought, and Professor X does just that.
Aside: I put ‘belief’ in quotes because they didn’t believe it was real, but it was a common and accepted fictional device. The X-Men, like most early marvel comics, is drawing on trending ideas in society at the time with a focus on what young boys might find cool. To see just how timely some of this was, there’s a span of a year or two in which radioactive cobalt pops up all over the marvel universe - Cobalt Man in X-Men, a cobalt bomb in Thor, etc... - which matches up with a couple year period in the real world that cobalt bombs were talked about as a real thing and loomed large in the popular imagination.
The astral plane is pretty explicitly a mental realm mechanically in the earliest D+D sources. You cannot enter it physically. Instead, you send an astral projection into it which duplicates everything you carry on you, and are tied to your physical body by a silver cord. The astral spell still uses these mechanics in 3.x, and velocity in the astral plane is still determined by willpower. But it’s not the legacy mechanics hanging around that bother us - they’re the things that are interesting about the astral. It’s the dumbing down of planar cosmology that annoys us, because it makes it less interesting to go wander the planes.
Before Planescape, the only way to gain access to the outer planes was through the astral. Inside, you would incarnate in a new body, but the silver cord remained (although it was impossible to see). The outer planes were still part of this mental realm which could not be entered by your physical body.
This reveals the real character of the outer planes. Think of the astral as a shared thought-realm by all sentient creatures. We go there in our dreams (see the astral plane description), and it connects us to ideas. Basically, the planar cosmology affirms the philosophy of language theory that words mean something because they point to a shared thought space that everyone can reference. In D+D, this thought space is platonic, that is, it contains ideal forms of the things in question. So when we say ‘Evil’, we mean those qualities represented by Hades, literally. Hades is the definition of pure Evil. Now, what that actually means is entirely up to how you want to characterize the planes.
In theory this means that other important concepts have their own outer planes somewhere in the astral. If you want to visit the Plane of Love or the Plane of Justice, have a blast. They’ll still follow the basic rules laid down in the outer planes section below, but the qualities they will exemplify will be Love or Justice and not Good or Evil.
The astute readers have realized that this means the gods exist in the heads of the sentient creatures of the primes, collectively. This explains why gods need belief. A god no one believes in exists in no one’s head, and thus doesn’t exist. (Or rather, doesn’t have a special existence as a god. No one needs to believe in individual pit fiends so long as someone believes in the concept of pit fiend). Just how much belief is required is up to the DM.
The Astral Plane
Like the ethereal, the astral is divided into a border astral and a deep astral. There is a border astral that is co-planar and co-spatial with all prime material planes. Other planes connected to the astral are also realms of pure thought, and do not have border astral co-spatial with them. (In effect, other planes the astral connects to are actually parts of the astral that have been sequestered and a particular character of thought has come to dominate).
The border astral overlays the prime it’s co-spatial with, but creatures in the prime cannot see you or detect you by any means except telepathy. Similarly, you cannot interact with creatures in the prime in any way except telepathy or similar spells which specifically manipulate the mind or the soul. (A magic jar spell could be used to possess a person in the prime from the border astral, for example). There are no features to the border astral, you simply see the prime material plane. You may not interact with objects, and may pass through most objects, but are blocked by more than 40’ of rock, 1’ of metal, or 1” of lead.
The deep astral is a featureless expanse of whiteness. Sentient creatures can influence the local area about themselves by thought alone. A sentient creature may use mirage arcana and major creation as at-will SLAs with a caster level equal to the greater of their intelligence or charisma score, but both effects end whenever they are more than (int or cha) x 10’ from the creator.
Occasionally thought-echoes create semi-permanent structures in the astral without a nearby mind actively maintaining them. These structures are isolated, and frequently draw visitors and inhabitants. Continuous reinforcement of structure can give these structures a reality of their own and expand the effected area, eventually creating new demi-planes.
Demi-planes and planes exist in the astral. The difference is mostly one of size category. (A plane is infinite, a demi-plane is not). While these are technically still part of the astral, within their borders their own rules apply and not those of the astral. Because the astral is not a spatial realm, these places may or may not appear to occupy apparent space, and their entrances need not be sensibly close together or share any logical mapping of entrance to exit position. The most common way an entrance to a plane or demi-plane is found in the astral is by portal.
Movement in the astral is determined by the better of your intelligence or charisma. All non-native creatures have a flight speed equal to 5’ x attribute with perfect maneuverability.
Navigating around the astral is easy. Moving from the border astral to the deep astral is instantaneous and merely requires willing it to occur. Finding any particular location in the deep astral requires merely holding it in your thoughts and willing to go to that place, and you will arrive at an entrance or in the appropriate border astral in 2d20 apparent hours. (You may attempt to arrive at a particular place within the border astral, and will be no more than 1d6 miles off).
Time passes differently in the astral. For every hour of time in the physical world, ten hours of time appear to pass in the astral. So long as a character has spent at least 24 apparent hours in the astral, she may regain spells as per normal based on the experienced time cycle, but does not need to rest beforehand. In general, astral characters do not tire and do not need rest.
Aside: Dream is part of the astral plane and borders all prime materials with sentient creatures. However, it is possible to be on the astral-prime border and not be in Dream. Treat it as a large demi-plane co-planar with the astral and bordering appropriate primes near where there are sleeping creatures. Entering Dream is difficult unless one is asleep, and you cannot planeshift or even astral travel there normally. Someone travelling in Dream does not see the Prime like a traveler in the border astral, instead they travel between the dreams of creatures and see phantasmagorical landscapes and places, just as if they were visiting the dreams of creatures in the bordering prime. Spell-use in Dream is perilous, although exact interpretation is left to the DM. Like the rest of the astral, characters do not get tired while traveling in Dream and may not rest or go to sleep.
The Outer Planes
Outer planes embody some higher concept or ideal. These can be the alignment planes of standard d20 cosmology or other things like Truth, Beauty, Love, and Justice. You can have them all in the same campaign.
All creatures native to a plane exemplify the plane’s defining characteristic somehow, although they may also have other qualities. Indeed, we see gods of love and justice in the alignment planes because they also represent those alignments. It’s quite possible for a god to be native to multiple outer planes and for her to have similar servants on all such planes.
Outer planes typically follow familiar rules for gravity and movement, although they need not do so. Outer planes are usually infinite in at least two directions (and may well be infinite vertically too, although players will rarely test this if the plane has a defined ground).
Many outer planes have multiple layers. Sometimes this separates different conceptions of the same ideal, other times it doesn’t. The only reason planes have as many layers as they do is because creatures believe they do, or possibly believe enough contradictory things about the ideal that it takes multiple layers to hold them all. Layers should generally differ in some way from others that are part of the same plane.
Outer planes are near timeless. Not in the literal sense (apparent time passes like in the astral), but in the sense that nothing really changes over long periods of time. The truth of the matter is that the weight of belief by sentient creatures across the prime material planes prevents any real change from occurring. You might slay Orcus, but there’ll be another one tomorrow. The Blood War exists not because anyone could ever win it, but because people expect demons and devils to fight over souls. This means there is no point in Sigil (we strongly recommend returning to the plane of Concordant Opposition and ignoring Sigil - it was pretty ignorable anyway), there is no real trade between the planes (the lower planes do traffic in souls, but only because they’re expected to do so), and there is no real interplanar politicking. The machinations of the Yugoloths are ultimately a fraud that can achieve no real ends.
The only way for lasting change to occur in the outer planes is for sentient creatures to believe change has occurred. So for any outerplanar creature to achieve lasting change, he must work through mortal agents or go ‘in person’ to the prime. Achieving such change is hard, and is the stuff cosmic battles between good and evil are made of - and the real battle will happen on the players’ home turf.
The only relevant competition between the outer planes is over the fates of the souls of mortals. Strangely enough, this is a competition that only matters before you die. Followers contribute more weight of belief than non-followers, so having people who worship you is even more valuable than having people aware of you. Active churches also tend to generate public awareness, which adds additional non-follower belief in your existence. (Even a secret sect creates more awareness than no sect, so if worshipping the god of murder would cause all right-thinking people to stab followers in the face, the god of murder should prefer secret organizations to no organization).
At the end of the day, the only game in town for outerplanar creatures is on the prime, so that’s where the game is played.
Aside: Dead Gods
If things don’t really change and belief is everything, how can gods die? On the one hand, there are the forgotten gods who have no followers and no one who believes in them. But that’s easy, and that doesn’t explain dead gods who have followers.
Gods die when they are slain and sentients believe they are dead. So if your cultists accept that some other god not only defeated you, but slew you, (and most other creatures believe that), then you’re actually dead. It doesn’t even have to be that extreme. Because weight of belief is important, if enough sentients actively believe you died, then it doesn’t even matter what your cultists believe. Would be god-slayers would do well to go around proclaiming their exploits and hiring bards to write songs, because actually stabbing the god in the face is only step one.
Aside: Alignment
Alignment is a mess in d20 and always has been in D+D. We’re not going to pretend to solve this here. All we’re going to say is that alignment planes are the very definition of their alignment. So whatever you define ‘Law’ to mean, that’s what Mechanus *is*. Or rather, whatever you make Mechanus be, that’s what ‘Law’ is. (And if Mechanus doesn’t suit you as a name, change it. This author prefers the older Nirvana anyway).
Aside: Alignment and the Outerplanar Natives
This conception of the outer planes requires that their denizens exemplify their alignment to the fullest. A pit fiend isn’t just lawful and evil, he is made of law and evil. That’s not metaphorical. He’s a creature of pure concept whose literal building blocks are law and evil. He does not have a biology. He is not composed of carbon molecules. He has no physicality whatsoever. It says [Evil] and [Law] on the tin because that’s his very nature. If this seems weird and alien to your players, then good. That’s exactly what it should feel like. For the most part these are not reasoning moral beings, they’re thought-puppets who behave like sentient creatures expect them to.
If you wish to allow outerplanar beings that break the mold and switch alignment or get redeemed, that’s fine. We have concepts for those things, so that can happen in thought space. But at some point your [Evil] succubus who has become good is either going to need to be reborn out of [Good] substance, or revert to type because her very being is suffused with [Evil]. This is okay, the relapsed villain and the servant of evil being reborn in a glorious body of the light are both interesting story prompts.
Similarly, if you do have a plane of Love, then all the natives should get the [Love] tag, and they are literally made of it. They should exemplify love, and if one of them falls into jealousy, then it should be treated exactly as the redeemed succubus above.
Aside: Alignment and the Prime
Good and evil for characters on the prime really isn’t in the same realm as alignment in the outer planes. It is strongly recommended that you don’t treat mortal evil the same as [Evil]. The evil fighter who has beers with the boys on weekends and loves puppies is okay. Seriously. But Pit Fiends simply can’t socialize with Archons or love puppies, it just doesn’t work.
Adventuring in the Conceptual Planes
Entering the astral plane usually requires an astral spell or similar magic. See the section on existence in the astral plane to understand exactly what this means for your character.
The conceptual planes have no access to the material planes. Spells which conjure material from the ethereal or inner planes do not function. Spells which require contact with the inner planes do not function. Clerics who worship powers in the material planes are cut off from their deities. This works exactly as described under the material planes, except that instead of positive and negative energy spells, you retain access to spells which gain their power from alignment. (Typically, those that have an alignment type).
Most notably, this means that spells which require positive or negative energy to function fail. Healing magic is impossible in the conceptual realms, as is the animation of undead. Creatures which appear to be undead in the outer planes are frequently constructs of appropriate ideals which simply look and act like undead - but those aren’t real bodies and they don’t use negative energy. Turning and rebuking do not work against such creatures.
Spells which create material instead create mental constructs which behaves similar to the material. So fireball creates the mental impression of a fiery explosion, and this works exactly as if a physical body was engulfed in a physical fireball. Similarly, spells which transmute objects still work on the mental constructs of those objects. Basically, most spells which don’t rely on access to the material planes work as usual.
Illusion spells have additional reality in the astral and outer planes. Treat all such spells as if they were cast with shadow conjuration in any outer plane or greater shadow conjuration in the astral itself. However, as you have no access to the plane of shadows, the spells of those names do not themselves function. In the astral plane (but not the outers), all illusion spells which create visual stimuli also roughly simulate tactile stimuli if touched. It will feel off if someone takes a moment (move action equivalent) to experience the object, but it has a physical reality until disbelieved.
You may not conjure creatures or materials from the plane you are currently on.
The spell magic jar does not function in the deep astral or outer planes - your spiritual self cannot posses a being of pure spirit, and all creatures in the conceptual planes are beings of pure thought. However, in the border astral it functions normally, except you don’t actually need a ‘jar’. You return to the border astral whenever you would return to the jar.
You may use planeshift in the conceptual planes, but only to travel to another conceptual plane. Planeshift cannot send a creature from a prime to the astral or vice versa. Using planeshift to travel between conceptual planes does not require ‘proximity’, as such concepts are illusory and meaningless in the underlying reality of these planes.
Gate permits ‘physical’ travel into and out of the conceptual planes. As with summoning spells, outsiders native to the conceptual planes are clothed in physical bodies when they enter the prime in this way. Using a gate to enter a conceptual plane magically transforms all your gear into idealized versions of themselves, and they become thoughts with real existence and persist when separated from you. See the section on Existence in the Conceptual Planes for more information. Gate can connect the prime to any conceptual plane, or connect any two conceptual planes. It does not permit connections between a conceptual plane and a material plane.
Existence in the Conceptual Planes
Entering the astral requires abandoning your body in almost all cases. Your body remains inert but basic life functions continue in your spirit’s absence. Any items you were carrying when you entered the astral plane create psychic duplicates on your new astral body and behave in all ways like the originals. Should items be removed from your physical person, they fade from your astral body within an hour. Single-use or charged items are expended as usual, the psychic connection triggers the real object when they are used. Items which you lose hold of fade into nothingness after one hour. The body still needs to eat and drink in this state, and for extended trips to the astral some arrangement will need to be made to see to these needs. If the physical body dies or is slain while the spirit is in the astral, treat it as if the silver cord has been cut (see below), but there is no living body to return to.
All spiritual visitors to the astral from prime material planes are connected back to their physical body by a silver cord. This is clearly visible for 10’ before fading to nothingness, and tethers the spirit to its body. Should the visitor die while in the conceptual planes, he immediately wakes up in his physical body.
Should the astral cord be cut, any items he has by virtue of his physical body fade away. Non-magical and expendable magic items disappear within an hour. Permanent magic items slowly fade away at the rate of 1 per apparent day. (Any items the character has acquired while in conceptual planes remain - these are part of his astral self and not connected to his physical self). As the character is now an unbound spirit, the afterlife calls to the character. He must make a Will Save (DC 20) once per day or be immediately pulled into the appropriate outer plane as a bodiless soul. A character who succeeds on all such Will Saves for one apparent year changes his type to Outsider and becomes a native of the plane on which he has spent the most time since his death. He gains all appropriate alignment subtypes for that plane.
Alternately, if the character’s physical body is still alive, he may attempt to rejoin his soul to his body. He must be present in the border astral near his body, and must be the recipient of a resurrection, true resurrection, wish, miracle, psychic surgery, or similar effect. There is no xp cost, loss, or level loss for this use of these spells. Successfully rejoining his soul to his body expels him from the astral plane and wakes him up. If the character’s body has died, however, appropriate magic to revive the body will be needed before his soul can be re-attached. This does carry all appropriate penalties (and yes, this may mean that resurrection needs to be cast twice). (Note: a character may use magic jar to possess his own body, but this does not actually re-attach the silver cord).
If you do manage to enter the conceptual planes with your physical body, such as with a gate spell, you and your gear are transformed into pure thought and become idealized versions of themselves. You have no silver cord in this state (and no physical body to return to). Your gear now has a separate existence from yourself, and does not fade when you lose it. You cease aging in this state, and can potentially become native to a conceptual plane. (Likely a PrC, work it out with your DM or one will get written eventually). Death while in such a state causes you to immediately be called to the appropriate afterlife with no save. Your physical body is utterly lost, and only a wish or miracle can restore you. Returning to the prime is also difficult - you can only return by a Gate or similar magic, which re-clothes your body and possessions in physical form. Despite the increased risks, this is also the only way to bring something physically back from the conceptual planes.
Sentient undead can enter the conceptual planes using astral spell or similar magic. Their spirit is just like any other creature’s, though it may well have the appearance of undeath. However, they are not affected by spells which specifically affect undead in this state (and such spells generally fail to function anyway, because of a lack of positive energy). Should an undead creature physically enter a conceptual plane it is immediately slain with no save. The energies animating it and tying the spirit to the dead body cannot function without negative energy.
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Post by Wiseman » Fri Mar 22, 2013 6:22 pm

Probably going to get raged against for this, but I feel compelled to point out an error in that pitfiends are [Law] and [Evil] Not [Chaotic].
Additionally, what's with the hate on planescape? I happen to like planescape. (or maybe I just happen to like anything that has to do with planar travel in general).
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Post by squirrelloid » Fri Mar 22, 2013 6:37 pm

> Wiseman wrote:Probably going to get raged against for this, but I feel compelled to point out an error in that pitfiends are [Law] and [Evil] Not [Chaotic].

Whoops, I must have confused it and Balors in my head.

> Additionally, what's with the hate on planescape? I happen to like planescape. (or maybe I just happen to like anything that has to do with planar travel in general).

(1) Sigil is stupid
(2) It fucked over what made the planes distinctive. It took away everything that made each plane special and made them all glorified prime material planes, all in the name of making it easy to survive on them.
(3) It fucked over planar cosmology. The limited connections had a logic behind them, after all.
(4) It fucked over the prime material. Why go there anymore? Demons and Devils are supposed to want to get into prime materials because that's where teh action is.
(5) It made these sweeping changes without bothering to go through the spell list and fix all sorts of legacy stuff, like astral travel.
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Post by Wiseman » Fri Mar 22, 2013 6:59 pm

Good points. Although, I did kind of like making the planes easier to travel on even if they're just baskin robbins versions of the prime.
Also, what ever happened to all the bizarre ways the planes screwed with your spells? I remember that in planescape, most of the planes had odd ways of making your spells work differently, like how you needed certain props to cast divinations, or that on acheron, all spells created some sort of "spell crystal" that flew off at casting and if caught could be used to reverse the effects of the spell. (at least I think that's how it worked.)
Also one thing I will criticize planescape about is that it claimed that belief could shape the multiverse, though I find no real mention of that anywhere after the fact.
Also about what's wrong with sigil. I read and enjoyed the other thread about the factions, and how they tend to not make sense. If it's about the factions, there is the whole faction war thing that kicks them out of the city. (which is arguably worse, as now sigils just a vanilla city...
Final note: Planescape is my favorite of all the D&D settings. (dragonlance is my second favorite... [i don't know if this is a good thing or a bad thing.
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Post by squirrelloid » Fri Mar 22, 2013 7:07 pm

> Wiseman wrote:Good points. Although, I did kind of like making the planes easier to travel on even if they're just baskin robbins versions of the prime.
> Also, what ever happened to all the bizarre ways the planes screwed with your spells? I remember that in planescape, most of the planes had odd ways of making your spells work differently, like how you needed certain props to cast divinations, or that on acheron, all spells created some sort of "spell crystal" that flew off at casting and if caught could be used to reverse the effects of the spell. (at least I think that's how it worked.)
> Also one thing I will criticize planescape about is that it claimed that belief could shape the multiverse, though I find no real mention of that anywhere after the fact.
> Also about what's wrong with sigil. I read and enjoyed the other thread about the factions, and how they tend to not make sense. If it's about the factions, there is the whole faction war thing that kicks them out of the city. (which is arguably worse, as now sigils just a vanilla city...
> Final note: Planescape is my favorite of all the D&D settings. (dragonlance is my second favorite... [i don't know if this is a good thing or a bad thing.

I'm all in favor of the bizarre spell effects on particular planes. Sadly, my 1st edition MotP (and despite some sources saying its 2nd, it predates the 2nd PHB by a year or more) is in a box somewhere, so i couldn't look them up. This is just a general guideline to how the cosmology itself screws with spells. You'll note most of this is first principle stuff.
Sigil is dumb for a number of reasons. (1) There can be no plane at the center of everything, because the material and conceptual planes are totally different things. One of these groups has no physical reality whatsoever. There is no center. The concept is incoherent. (2) Its function is already better served by prime material planes. Prime material planes also have actual stakes that matter. (3) At the end of the day, you can't make portals to everywhere unless you are a prime material plane. Where exactly is sigil that it's *not* a prime material plane, and what makes this place so special? This question is never answered. (4) The faction book review sort of makes it clear just how dumb sigil is.
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Post by Wiseman » Fri Mar 22, 2013 7:13 pm

Thanks. Either way, I fully support this and am bookmarking this page.
Also, if anything the prime material is at the center of all. (though what that makes the outlands is a subject of debate.)
And the main purpose of sigil is basically a hub town for planar campaign. Though I agree that it might as well be a prime town (or a demiplane of some sort. That might work better). I never considered sigil the center of anything.
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Post by Surgo » Fri Mar 22, 2013 7:59 pm

> squirelloid wrote:Outer planes are near timeless. Not in the literal sense (apparent time passes like in the astral), but in the sense that nothing really changes over long periods of time. The truth of the matter is that the weight of belief by sentient creatures across the prime material planes prevents any real change from occurring. You might slay Orcus, but there’ll be another one tomorrow.

This is such a boring interpretation, though, and kind of kills a lot of reasons to bother going on a plane adventure at all. Wouldn't it be more interesting for the game if the adventurers who slayed Orcus actually, in the process of doing that, changed the belief of sentient creatures worlds over?
http://www.dnd-wiki.org -- the wiki
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Post by squirrelloid » Fri Mar 22, 2013 8:59 pm

> Surgo wrote:

> > squirelloid wrote:Outer planes are near timeless. Not in the literal sense (apparent time passes like in the astral), but in the sense that nothing really changes over long periods of time. The truth of the matter is that the weight of belief by sentient creatures across the prime material planes prevents any real change from occurring. You might slay Orcus, but there’ll be another one tomorrow.

> This is such a boring interpretation, though, and kind of kills a lot of reasons to bother going on a plane adventure at all. Wouldn't it be more interesting for the game if the adventurers who slayed Orcus actually, in the process of doing that, changed the belief of sentient creatures worlds over?

That's actually consistent, so it certainly works. I don't see anything wrong with that. It does require Orcus slaying be kind of rare.
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Post by hyzmarca » Fri Mar 22, 2013 9:20 pm

> squirrelloid wrote:

> > Surgo wrote:

> > > squirelloid wrote:Outer planes are near timeless. Not in the literal sense (apparent time passes like in the astral), but in the sense that nothing really changes over long periods of time. The truth of the matter is that the weight of belief by sentient creatures across the prime material planes prevents any real change from occurring. You might slay Orcus, but there’ll be another one tomorrow.

> > This is such a boring interpretation, though, and kind of kills a lot of reasons to bother going on a plane adventure at all. Wouldn't it be more interesting for the game if the adventurers who slayed Orcus actually, in the process of doing that, changed the belief of sentient creatures worlds over?

> That's actually consistent, so it certainly works. I don't see anything wrong with that. It does require Orcus slaying be kind of rare.

That depends if there is a memory hole or not. If its people used to believe in Orcus but don't anymore, then it requires Orcus Slaying to be rare. If it's no one ever believed in Orcus and we've always been at war with East Asia, then you can have a lot of Orcus slaying and no one but the slayers would notice. This lets you have a whole hidden history filled with dead gods and murdered demon princes.
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Post by Username17 » Fri Mar 22, 2013 9:28 pm

I think it important to remember that the original planar writeup was also extremely stupid.

> The Outer Planes: 9-25, PHB 1978 wrote:9. The Astral Plane radiates from the Prime Material to a non-space where endless vortices spiral to the parallel Prime Material Planes and to the Outer Planes as well. Thus, this plane can be used to travel the universe(s) or to the Outer Planes which are the homes of powerful beings, the source of alignment (religious/philosophical/ethical ideals), the deities. Note that the Astral Plane touches only the upper layers of the Outer Planes. Use of this plane is explained later.
> 10. The Seven Heavens of absolute lawful good.
> 11. The Twin Paradises of neutral good lawfuls.
> 12. The planes of Elysium of neutral good.
> 13. The Happy Hunting Grounds of neutral good chaotics.
> 14. The planes of Olympus of absolute good chaotics.
> 15. The planes of Gladsheim (Asgard Valhala, Vanaheim, etc.) of chaotic good neutrals.
> 16. The planes of Limbo of neutral (absolute) chaos (entropy).
> 17. The Planes of Pandemonium of chaotic evil neutrals.
> 18. The 666 layers of the Abyss of absolute chaotic evil.
> 19. The planes of Tarterus of evil chaotic neutrals.
> 20. Hades' "Three Glooms" of absolute (neutral) evil.
> 21. The furnaces of Gehenna of lawful evil neutrals.
> 22. The Nine Hells of absolute lawful evil.
> 23. The nether planes of Acheron of lawful evil neutrals.
> 24. Nirvana of absolute (neutral) lawfuls.
> 25. The planes of Arcadia of neutral good lawfuls.

All spelling mistakes and weird changes in formatting are from the original text. The outer planes were a catastrofuck there to prop up the weird and totally bogus "alignment graph". The idea was that different amounts of law and evil were quantifiable somehow and that different amounts of each flowed from gods who lived in one of the layers of Hell, one of the furnaces of Gehenna, or one of the nether worlds of Acheron. That is stupid.
9 years later, Jeff Grubb made the original Manual of the Planes, which was a garbled peyote trip from a nonsensical jerkface. The key to fixing the planes is ditching the absolute fuck out of the great wheel cosmology altogether and writing up anything at all to stand in its place.
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Post by squirrelloid » Fri Mar 22, 2013 10:03 pm

> FrankTrollman wrote:I think it important to remember that the original planar writeup was also extremely stupid.

> > The Outer Planes: 9-25, PHB 1978 wrote:9. The Astral Plane radiates from the Prime Material to a non-space where endless vortices spiral to the parallel Prime Material Planes and to the Outer Planes as well. Thus, this plane can be used to travel the universe(s) or to the Outer Planes which are the homes of powerful beings, the source of alignment (religious/philosophical/ethical ideals), the deities. Note that the Astral Plane touches only the upper layers of the Outer Planes. Use of this plane is explained later.
> > 10. The Seven Heavens of absolute lawful good.
> > 11. The Twin Paradises of neutral good lawfuls.
> > 12. The planes of Elysium of neutral good.
> > 13. The Happy Hunting Grounds of neutral good chaotics.
> > 14. The planes of Olympus of absolute good chaotics.
> > 15. The planes of Gladsheim (Asgard Valhala, Vanaheim, etc.) of chaotic good neutrals.
> > 16. The planes of Limbo of neutral (absolute) chaos (entropy).
> > 17. The Planes of Pandemonium of chaotic evil neutrals.
> > 18. The 666 layers of the Abyss of absolute chaotic evil.
> > 19. The planes of Tarterus of evil chaotic neutrals.
> > 20. Hades' "Three Glooms" of absolute (neutral) evil.
> > 21. The furnaces of Gehenna of lawful evil neutrals.
> > 22. The Nine Hells of absolute lawful evil.
> > 23. The nether planes of Acheron of lawful evil neutrals.
> > 24. Nirvana of absolute (neutral) lawfuls.
> > 25. The planes of Arcadia of neutral good lawfuls.

> All spelling mistakes and weird changes in formatting are from the original text. The outer planes were a catastrofuck there to prop up the weird and totally bogus "alignment graph". The idea was that different amounts of law and evil were quantifiable somehow and that different amounts of each flowed from gods who lived in one of the layers of Hell, one of the furnaces of Gehenna, or one of the nether worlds of Acheron. That is stupid.
> 9 years later, Jeff Grubb made the original Manual of the Planes, which was a garbled peyote trip from a nonsensical jerkface. The key to fixing the planes is ditching the absolute fuck out of the great wheel cosmology altogether and writing up anything at all to stand in its place.
> -Username17

I'm not actually going to disagree. The great wheel is dumb. Alignment is dumb.
(1) I wrote assuming people were going to use the great wheel because that didn't involve rewriting most of the monster manual. However, you'll note I spent little time actually talking about particular outer planes.
(2) I fully encourage running outer planes based on ideals that we can actually put some shape to, if not define, like Love, Justice, Tyranny/Oppression, etc... The key here is that they are ideals and exist in thought space, not that it has to be the great wheel.
Now, whether you think the astral plane being a thought realm (and thus the planes accessible by it being thought realms) is a good idea is a different thing entirely. Of course, that really is what 'astral plane' means (the thought realm part), and is older than D+D by a century or more. It does not need to be a connecting realm.
An alternate scheme would be structuring your planes on the Kabbalistic Sephirot and Qlippot, where the World Sephirot is the primes. (And you'd probably have the ethereal/inner planes adjoin there and be otherwise separate). Whether or not you care to use the Astral as a connector between these realms and the world would be up to you, or just have it as its own realm entirely and not a gateway plane to further planes.
Other mystical systems have their own structures which could serve as well.
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Post by Username17 » Fri Mar 22, 2013 11:41 pm

To give an idea of how bad the actual Manual of the Planes (1987) was that Zeb Cook was whitewashing actually was:

> Manual of the Planes wrote:Thieves retain their abilities, but against a native of the plane they suffer a -20% modifier to their attempts (A thief attempting to sneak past a magman in the plane of para-elemental Magma must subtract 20% from the chance of success, but attempting to open a lock in that plane incurs no penalty).

When Zeb Cook said he was getting rid of stuff that made it difficult to adventure on the planes, that is the kind of bullshit he was mostly talking about. The planes had some serious bullshit that made them a pain in the ass and not cool in any way.
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